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Georgia and South Ossetia at war
#26
Tim Wrote:To edisan and technolyze,
I am georgian, 47 years old and live in Tbilisi, which is bombing now by russian air planes!

I know what is KGB and see what is FSB. You can change your name but never change your mind. So FSB=KGB.

I know many ossetians living in all parts of georgia, even have relatives and know their opinions. Of course I do not speak about Kokoev and his klan.

You writing desinformation
Georgia attack first
and chechens nation is terrorists, who killed children in school in Beslan
#27
Excellent,
Chechen nation is terrorist, so we should kill all of them - children, women, elders, invalids or clear their minds to think as we need!!!
Chechen refugees live in Georgia in peace and they are not terrorist. They are as kind as other people.

Georgia can not fight against ossetians. This is lie. We fight against bandits, which have no nations, which were bombing georgian villages, killing civilians - women, children, elders. But the most important is that they fight against us with russian weapons, russian instructors and with support of russian so called "peacekeepers". And finally everything this became impossible not to answer.
#28
Tim Wrote:Excellent,
Chechen nation is terrorist, so we should kill all of them - children, women, elders, invalids or clear their minds to think as we need!!!
Chechen refugees live in Georgia in peace and they are not terrorist. They are as kind as other people.

Georgia can not fight against ossetians. This is lie. We fight against bandits, which have no nations, which were bombing georgian villages, killing civilians - women, children, elders. But the most important is that they fight against us with russian weapons, russian instructors and with support of russian so called "peacekeepers". And finally everything this became impossible not to answer.

oh yea you killed ossetian peoples because they bandits? :lol: this is lie
chechen and dag too bandits and what? they kind another nation? Oh no, you a wrong
Sorry, but your words a very funny
#29
The Times write... The president of Georgia is responsible for an attack to South Ossetia. The western mass-media now analyze the conflict in South Ossetia. British "Times" has published unexpected comments. The edition admits the fact, that the initiator of aggression was Georgia, and the responsibility for an event is born by the Georgian president. Its attempt to return Abkhazia and South Ossetia force in clause is named " dangerous and precipitate " by step which has actually put Russia and Georgia before threat of war.

Will suffice to say lies... Georgia wages information war!

by Tim
Georgia helped the Chechen terrorists! They disappeared in your territory!
#30
Russian peacekeepers should have done their job in the conflict zone, but from time to time south osetians attacked georgian villages in the region. There was no help from russian peacekeepers. They never protected georgians in the zone. This is the fact! Georgia intends to enter NATO, and this fact irritates Russia and they do everything to keep tense situation in the conflict zone. In the beginning of August separatists attacked georgian villages, georgians had to do their job! They entered the zone and protected the villages. Separatists opend the fire and georgians had to use their army not to let the separatists back to the villages. Later it was decided to enter the capital of South Osetia and the separatists ran away to Russia. They had no strength to fight without russian forces. By the way, the members of the south osetian government are Russian officials. This is no secret. The population of Souh Osetia is about 45 thousand people. About 30 thousand osetians and 15 000 georgians. Before the first war the georgian population was much more than today. Georgia has thousands of refugees. Osetians also live outside the conflict zone, in Georgia. Osetians came to Georgia from North Caucasus, their native land. And there was no national hatred between this two nations endeed. These two nations lived together for many years. In the past some of Georgian kings were Osetians by nationality and this two nations always fought together against muslim invaders and even russians! Stalin gave to this territory autonomy in the frames of Georgia, but after the collapse of The Soviet Union the autonomy declared independance and wonted to enter Russian Federation. Russia helped them with their weapon, and made Georgians run from the capital Tskhinvali. Today there are Osetians who want to live with Georgians, even some of the people who fought against Georgia in the past. But Russians always had their plans over this situation and always did everything to make these two nations enemies. Today there are hundreds of russian tanks in the conflict zone. Russian army is fighting against Georgians, there are no more separatists in the zone. Russia bombed several Georgian cities and killed peaceful civilians. Russians say that Georgians destroyed south osetian capital Tskhinvali, but this is not true. When Georgian army entered Tskhinvali russian aviation and army began to bomb the city to drive georgian troops out. Russians destroyd the city.
#31
by James
The bald lie! What for to small republic to attack Georgia? This suicide who will believe in such bosh. On Peacemakers of the Russian army has been striked blow by the Georgian army.... Peacemakers of Russia are armed by a small arms... Georgians fired at them from tanks! 2000 people were lost, people you though understand that write, 2000 innocent people were lost from for the Georgian attack, on sleeping city!
#32
Thank you James. This is absolute true what you said. That's why I said: this is war between Russia and Georgia. And the goal of Russian agression is to change current democratically elected government with pro russian one, change geopolitacal balance and keep tension between caucasian people to act than as a "peacekeeper". This is not my opinion. This was declared by PUTIN, which EDISAN compared to other totalitar leaders in the world - Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, etc. This will lead Russia to a catastrope finally. And one thing, Russians and Georgians are Orthodox people!!! Unbelievable how shovinizm and black ambition can blind people!!!
#33
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.rferl.org/content/South_Ossetia_Crisis_Could_Be_Russian_Chance_To_Defeat_Siloviki/1189525.html">http://www.rferl.org/content/South_Osse ... 89525.html</a><!-- m -->

South Ossetia Crisis Could Be Russia's Chance To Defeat Siloviki

South Ossetian leader Eduard Kokoity (right) outside Tskhinvali on August 7
August 08, 2008
By Yulia Latynina

Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili has handed his Russian counterpart, Dmitry Medvedev, a victory over the "siloviki" in Russia. And if Medvedev is able to take advantage of the fruits of this victory, the consequences will be significant not so much for Tbilisi as for Moscow.

So, why is this a victory over the siloviki -- those in the Russian ruling elite with close ties to the state security organs? Because there is no way the regime in South Ossetia can be in any sense called "separatist." Who there is a separatist? The head of the local KGB, Anatoly Baranov, used to head the Federal Security Service (FSB) in the Russian Republic of Mordovia. The head of the South Ossetian Interior Ministry, Mikhail Mindzayev, served in the Interior Ministry of Russia's North Ossetia. The South Ossetian "defense minister," Vasily Lunev, used to be military commissar in Perm Oblast, and the secretary of South Ossetia's Security Council, Anatoly Barankevich, is a former deputy military commissar of Stavropol Krai. So who exactly is a separatist in this government? South Ossetian "prime minister" Yury Morozov?

However, alas, I also cannot say this regime is "pro-Russian." On the contrary, all the recent actions of Eduard Kokoity, the leader of the breakaway South Ossetian government, have run counter to the interests of Russia in the Caucasus -- beginning with his embarrassing Russia in the eyes of the international community and ending with his ratcheting up the tensions in the very region where Russia might begin to come undone. South Ossetia is not a territory, not a country, not a regime. It is a joint venture of siloviki generals and Ossetian bandits for making money in a conflict with Georgia. For me, the most surprising thing in this entire story is the complete lack of any strategic goals on the part of the South Ossetians.

As soon as Russia tamped down the war in Abkhazia, tensions in South Ossetia started rising. South Ossetian forces start shelling Georgian villages, and as soon as Georgia returns fire, the airwaves are filled with accusations of "Georgian aggression." No one pays attention to the fact that when this happens, Kokoity is not on the front lines or visiting the injured in a hospital -- he's 1,000 kilometers away in Abkhazia, apparently offering the Russian siloviki his people as hostages, as another card to be played to inflame the situation and make a few more dollars.

Again -- nothing that is going on in South Ossetia makes any sense from the point of view of strategy. It only makes sense as a means of making money. And we aren't talking about small sums. Running a gas pipeline through the mountains from Russia -- a precaution in case Georgia decides to cut off the 70,000 residents -- cost $570 million. And then there is the secret budget Russia has allotted for the struggle -- estimated at somewhere around $800 million. And don't forget the pensions and wages for state-sector workers, who officially number some 80,000 but whose actual numbers are not more than 30,000.

'Terrorist State'

Whenever someone starts telling us about shelling in Tskhinvali, it is important to keep in mind exactly what Tskhinvali is. It is not a city somewhere in the middle of a republic that is being fired upon by saboteurs. On three sides, Tskhinvali is surrounded by Georgian villages. The edge of Tskhinvali is a military outpost. South Ossetian forces fire from there into the Georgian villages, and the Georgians respond with fire of their own. To help keep Georgian fire from hitting civilians in the city, all the South Ossetians would have to do is move their military base forward a couple hundred meters.

But, of course, it is a fundamental principle of terrorists the world over -- set up firing points in civilian areas and then when your enemy fires on you, you gleefully parade the bodies of your own children in front of the television cameras. Kokoity's terrorists are following this same principle. If South Ossetia can in any way be considered a state, it must be considered a terrorist state.

When we are told about "peaceful civilians" in South Ossetia, we must keep in mind that the situation there is similar to that in Palestinian refugee camps. South Ossetia, like the Palestinian Liberation Organization before it, is not a state or an ethos or a territory. It is a peculiar form of mutated government in which residents have been turned into militarized refugees. It is a quasi-armed force that is not allowed by the authorities to occupy itself with anything other than war -- a situation that gives the authorities absolute power and absolute control over the money at its disposal. It is a place where the hysteria of this disfigured population is the primary means of filling the authorities' personal coffers.

Even more surprising is the fact that the leaders of this region -- despite all their talk -- apparently have done very little to prepare for war and have turned out to be absolutely helpless. At the first sign of trouble, the general director of this joint venture hightailed it out of Tskhinvali. I was amazed to get news overnight that Russian journalists were hunkered down in the main government building and there wasn't even a bomb shelter there. What does that mean? That all the money Moscow allocated for our joint venture never made it outside the Moscow ring road? They were all shouting "Wolf, wolf!" but they didn't even manage to build a barn for the sheep?

Georgia, I think, will win in this conflict for the simple reason that it has a clear strategic goal. The Russian siloviki do not. Moreover, it turns out that these people -- who are pretty good at bankrupting factories and terrorizing companies -- ran without looking back when faced with a real army and all they are capable of doing is complaining to the United Nations.

War Of Lies

It would seem that the siloviki really thought that there is nothing more to war than lying. Lying about "unprovoked shelling" and about wounded "civilians" who are shown on television wearing camouflage. They are still using this tactic: What are we to make of their claims during the night that Georgian airplanes had bombed a column of humanitarian aid coming out of the Roki Tunnel between North and South Ossetia? I'd like to know who was the Russian general who -- on the very night when Saakashvili had been issued a moratorium and tanks and heavy equipment were moving from Russia to Tskhinvali -- decided to clog up the only road with a humanitarian convoy. If there is such an idiot, he should, at the least, be demoted to the ranks. The siloviki supposed that the war would be won by the side that lied the most. Saakashvili knew that the war would be won by the one who won the war.

The latest events prove that Russia does not control what Kokoity does. Temur Iakobashvili, the Georgian minister for reintegration, arrived recently in Tskhinvali for talks and the Russian Foreign Ministry did everything it could to facilitate them. But Kokoity simply left the city. Saakashvili announced a unilateral cease-fire and in response, to show that the joint venture needs more money, South Ossetians opened fire on the villages of Tamarasheni and Prisi. We can only hope that Georgia sees that at least some in the Kremlin do not intend to support Kokoity. You can support an ally. You can prop up a puppet. But you cannot support a joint venture that is just pumping money out of the Russian budget by means of inflaming the Caucasus.

So, I repeat -- Saakashvili has bankrupted the joint venture of the Lubyanka chekisty and the Ossetian bandits. Russia, as a country, has no interest in this enterprise. And the joint venture only had one interest in Russia -- the same interest that a cancerous tumor has on its host body. We can only thank Saakashvili for the chemotherapy.

The main question in the current situation is what will Russia do now. There are two choices. One would be to get entangled in a full-scale war, which is what the siloviki have been trying to force Moscow to do for the last few months. It doesn't matter to them who wins that war or how many victims there are. The mere fact of a war will mean that the siloviki will maintain their control over Russia. In fact, a defeat for Russia would be even better for the siloviki than a victory; there would be shouts, recriminations, hysterics, and -- in the end -- more money.

The second scenario is that this is a chance for Medvedev and for Russia. If Russia stays out of the fighting, that would be a defeat for the siloviki. And, maybe, the complete bankruptcy not just of their branch office in South Ossetia, but of the home office on Lubyanka as well.

Yulia Latynina is a columnist for "Novaya gazeta" and a host on Ekho Moskvy. This comment was originally published by "Yezhednevny zhurnal." The views expressed in this commentary are the author's own and do not necessarily reflect those of RFE/RL
#34
Only one blind here is you Tim. Look at your soldiers in TV , who armed and trained them and why?
When your country left Soviet Union why did you denied freedom of choice for South Osetia and Abchazia?
They never accepted Georgian rule and fought for independence, they were defacto independent so it is Georgian soil only technikly.
Russian peacekeepers kept peace for decade, and it is Georgia who claimed that they will never use force against thier own people, now you are telling that Russians are liers.
The only lyer is Saakashvili he promises peace hours before the attack, who is like Hitler here?
#35
Georgia tried to clear South Ossetian Republic from South Ossetian people…Genocide in 21 century!

Georgia (at this time - M Saakashvili) attacks his nearest Independent Repablic in third time in the world history. At this time 8 hours before opening of Olympic games. And in the third time in the history Russia tries to save South Ossetian people from total annihilation. But the most important in this situation is how this “event” shown in the most of Europian, American and Chinese mass media. The first report in this mass media wasn’t Georgia attacks South Ossetia and destroyed 8 villages with tanks and heavy weapon, the first report was “Russia attacks Georgia”. This is bull shit. I never can’t even imagine that as authority sources as BBC and CNN will be lie so open and wide.
Here it is the real sequence of events:
The day before opening fire, M.Saakashvili was in the South Ossetia and written the “non-aggression pact”.
Several hours after that (00.00 of 8th august), Georgian troops with heavy weapon, artillery and aircrafts begin the attack on 8 South Ossetian villages and Tshinvali the capitol of this Independent Republic. (I repeat Independent because it’s not a Georgian province or as say in western mass media “Separatist Republic”. South Ossetia and Abkhazia are Independent Republics, that Georgia always (during last 200 years) wanted to join to it’s territory with force.)
In several hours this 8 villages was completely destroyed and almost all civilians was killed there. Just few civilians escaped scatheless. They told that some civilian houses was destroyed with Georgian tanks tracks with live people inside it’s basements.
After that, Georgian troops begins heavy artillery bombardment of the sleeping city Tshinvalli. They used heavy artillery weapon and Rocket systems for the attack on this city without any notice. Most of the civilians died in their own beds. It is this picturies were shown by CNN and BBC next day with comments that Russia attacks Georgia. (direct lie)
After heavy artillery preparation Georgian troops and heavy armors entered the almost destroyed Tshinvali where they begin to kill all alive civilians. (You can see this picture on CNN and BBS it was shown by mistake then Georgian trooper shoot in the unarmed civilian but killed dog and after that Georgian light MCV tried to finish him and shooting in the house).
After Georgian troops entered the city one of their subdivision were direct to the Russian Peacekeepers Headquarter in Tshinvali.
Georgian troops and tanks begin direct fire to the Russian peacekeepers. All Russian MCV were destroyed 10 Peacekeepers were killed. Our troops begins to defend their base and ask for help.
About 150 more Russian Peacekeepers were still alive and fighting to defend their lives.
All the day Georgian Aircrafts and artillery were systematic destroying the city and civilians.
About 03:00 GMT (7:00 Moscow time) Russia asked for immediate meeting of United Nations Security Council, which has been ended without any result (As said one of the member “it’s too late, they can’t do anything because just wanted to sleep”) while South Ossetian people were dieing in the basements of their own homes.
And only after that Russian Army had to enter Republic of South Ossetia (Not Georgia).
And only this were shown in Europian and American mass media.
Georgian aircrafts continue attacks on city, villages and Russian Airforce had to destroy several flight strips in Georgia to prevent this flights.

Ask yourself what Georgian troops do in the civilian city Tshinvali?
Ask yourself then M.Saakashvili said the truth during last 2 years? All his politics is pure lie.
Ask yourself why he didn’t want to sign any legal peace convention with South Ossetia?
Ask yourself why all this facts were shown inverse for you?
Ask yourself why Europian and American mass media didn’t show you the real begin of this genocide?
Ask yourself Why Europian flag is behind M.Saakashvili?
Ask yourself Why he interrupted broadcast of Russian channels in his republic, is this Democracy?
Ask yourself Why Georgian television shows South Ossetian civilians killed by his troops and say that it is killed Georgian civilians?

Now Imagine yourself that Russian forces in this region is 10 times more then whole Georgian army and if Russian forces really wanted to enter the Georgia it will be destroyed in 4-5 hours. And if there are a little brain in your head you will understand that we just triing to save peace in this region we triing to save small South Ossetian people from total annihilation. 2000 South Ossetian are already dead!! Can u understand this ? Dead! Killed in their own homes while sleeping just right before the beginning of the Olympic games. Georgian troops and artillery contine to attack at this time. They shooting the road with red cross cars. All the claims of Georgia about peace is bullshit. They just triing to kill as many Ossetians as they can.

I can say only one thing. Almost all that shown on BBC and CNN is “inverse true”. I don’t know why this happens, but this fact excite me very much. There are no more Soviet Union with it’s communist party. There is Russia now. And if you look at the map you will understand that we have enough territory. The only aggressive country in the world is unfortunately USA now. USA instructors have been training Georgian troops last 2 year. They trained them well to kill civilians. Good job... We are democracy country now...and we elect our president and government not to begin a war!

For whole Russian history (Not USSR) Russia NEVER declair war first. We were always defend our territory. From the several turkey wars then they tried to capture our south prvinces 300 years ago, after that from Napoleon army then we save whole Europe from his aggression, after that from Japanese army which tried to capture our Eastern region, then from Hitler I hope you know who is Hitler… think about this. And think deep hard about what news you see… truth or lie.
But remember one thing Russia never wanted and never will want a war .
#36
Let's head back to the beginning. Where has all this started? It started with Georgia invading South Osetia and starting a pure genocide. Killing civilians is a pure example of agression.
Allright, let's try to watch from the Georgia's side: They fight for territory right? Right! They need land and absolutely don't care about people (killing civilians shows it). Why do they need land with no people? Right! Resources and a better political and military position. Georgia isn't an overpopulated country, so it also isn't a question of giving the land to the citizens of Georgia. So the point is, that this war is absolutely immoral if we look from Georgias side.
Now let's look from the Russia's side: Their neighbour-region, the most closest to Russia is being attacked. If we look from the political side - it's a clearly seen threat to a country, if someone starts military actions close to your borders. Another important thing is the fact, that a great percentage of Osetian citizens are russians. So Russia helps it's own nation. For those who ask, why don't Russia take all the russian osetians back to Russia. And why should osetian russians leave? Whould you leave your homeland just for having a safe place to live? I would definetely not. These people need their homeland and they won't leave it forever just to live safely.
So the Russia sends their peacekeepers, who get killed, while protecting not only TERRITORY, but also PEOPLE. And it wasn't Georgia beeing attacked, it was Osetia beeing defended. It's a coin with two sides.

And let's look for some other facts: Georgias military power has risen 30(!) times in past few years. One month before war there was a military training in Georgia including U.S. forces and Georgias forces called "Immediate response". Also, Georgia was supported by pro-american countries, such as Ukraine and Latvia (just 2 examples from more than 2 existing). As we see, Russia itself is getting surrounded, and now a war has come to it's border.Always pay attention to facts, because "facts are a stubborn thing" © Iosif Dzhugashvili.


P.S.: We are living in a terrifiying era of informational wars. If you want to know the truth, don't trust only one side and read more then one newspaper. Gather the facts and use logic. I hope Osetia will have its peace back soon.
#37
Oddly enough , the whole case has almost nothing to do with Georgia and Ossetia themselves, which are just pawns in big political game. The meaning is that Putin is showing extreme disregard to the US, official Georgian ally. This conflict is planned beforehand, carefully arranged and perfectly timed provocation of Moscow. Moscow shows the teeth to the world and declare they can do what they please with their former satellites.
The response of the world leaders is weak and sluggish. The UN seems not be up to anything efficient. The USA govt pretends they have no much to do with this. Seems there are no forces left in the modern world to solve such problems. Russia and its militarized govt gets really dangerous. Sad.
#38
ahealen Wrote:Oddly enough , the whole case has almost nothing to do with Georgia and Ossetia themselves, which are just pawns in big political game. The meaning is that Putin is showing extreme disregard to the US, official Georgian ally. This conflict is planned beforehand, carefully arranged and perfectly timed provocation of Moscow. Moscow shows the teeth to the world and declare they can do what they please with their former satellites.
The response of the world leaders is weak and sluggish. The UN seems not be up to anything efficient. The USA govt pretends they have no much to do with this. Seems there are no forces left in the modern world to solve such problems. Russia and its militarized govt gets really dangerous. Sad.

Agreed. It's all a "big" political game with people beeing slaughtered. But still, I see much more agression form U.S. side than from Russia's side. But this is a subjective opinion. Hopefully, we'll see the truth in the future.
#39
hi
#40
But why in this "big political game" Georgia attack civilians at night?
and television told only about russian invasion...
or u didn't believe that Russia enter the city the day after genocide begins?
U r sitting in comfortable chair before monitor now and said about Russian teeth while civilian people diing.
Read history of this conflict before say smth about Russian teeth.

Imagine the situation then one of your neighbor begins to kill other weaker neighbors one by one while they are sleeping. will u just watch at this and saying “omg, that’s bad, stop killing!they are my friends” or may be you will do anything?
#41
Hi
Im from Russia

Saakashvili is lier. Hi killed a lot of people... Im shocked with west reports in TV.
You have to look at russian tv and post// and you will see how georgian solders carving abhazian woomen ! or runing over childeren by tanks! You dont see the blood and suffering
but you blind! You dont wont to see the true!
#42
if you cah read russian try to look at:
<!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.vesti.ru">http://www.vesti.ru</a><!-- w -->
<!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.vzglyad.ru">http://www.vzglyad.ru</a><!-- w -->
<!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.gazeta.ru">http://www.gazeta.ru</a><!-- w -->

or just look at photos and youll perharps will understand any thing
#43
From Russian side it looks like that: Georgian forces started massive attack against South Osetia killing civilians and peacekeepers, using artilery and heavy weapons they are destroyng Tshinvali.
How else could Russia respond? Her people and soldiers were dying! And Georgian government knew it, if they didnt then, all i can say:it is hard to live without a brain.
Ask yourself if soldiers of your country were under massive assult (while maintaining peace according to international treaties) and assking for help would you approve immidiate millitary assistance?
And about Moscow teeth. U.S. and some other countries have already shown all the world that one who had no teeth will fall victim to the predators.
#44
According to " Your DAY ", Michael Saakashvili tried to impose on itself hands, having found war lost. The security guard has beaten out at it from a hand a pistol at the last minute - physicians consider a mental condition of the president of Georgia inadequate.
When on the president of Georgia have reported, that civil guardsmen are helped by Vitaly Kaloev well-known for the whole world, it has turned pale. In fact this osset who has killed the Swiss aviadispatcher, the Russian plane guilty of destruction, became a symbol of revenge. Now in Ossetia thousand such, whose hearts burn thirst of punishment for the spilled blood of children, women and old men.
- Saakashvili it is already sentenced, - the Tbilisi taxi drivers, - at us do not hide Caucasus, mountains. And anybody yet did not cancel laws of blood feud. In fact at the order to fire Tskhinval it has given. It will find and in America …
Georgians contemptiously name leader Mishiko. And already openly spit on its portraits. In armies jokes about main weapon Saakashvili go: " gun Mishiko hides in trousers ". Its love affairs are discussed by all Georgia.
According to "ТD", Saakashvili tried to phone to the Kremlin and demanded to connect it to the President of Russia. But Dmitry Medvedev has refused to talk to it.
===================================================
Mr. Saakashvilli cease to kill Ossetic people!!!
#45
Mikhail Duzhin Wrote:But why in this "big political game" Georgia attack civilians at night?
and television told only about russian invasion...
or u didn't believe that Russia enter the city the day after genocide begins?
U r sitting in comfortable chair before monitor now and said about Russian teeth while civilian people diing.
Read history of this conflict before say smth about Russian teeth.

Imagine the situation then one of your neighbor begins to kill other weaker neighbors one by one while they are sleeping. will u just watch at this and saying “omg, that’s bad, stop killing!they are my friends” or may be you will do anything?

Could you please try to see a picture a bit wider? Why do you believe Saakashvili suddenly got mad and started killing? Isn't it clear he had been provoked, and lost the temper. Do you really believe Putin invaded because of his humanism and love for the miserable? Learn how Russian citizens appeared in Georgia, first.
BTW, Putin had been committing the same genocide in Chechnia in YEARS, not just one day. And now he is oh so sensible to war crimes. I don't buy the bullshit.
#46
Wow,
I was log off for a while, but now i am here answering all of you.

Really do not expect so much reaction after some last postings. That's good.

First of all, as you all say, if one would like to find truth, one should listen and watch both battling sides.

So why you did not listen, read and watch what georgians say. Ok, you hate Saakashvili, we hate Putin. But this is not a battle between this 2 man, but between nations: Russian and Georgian. You think that georgians have opposit opinion but Saakashvili force them. Very foolish idea! Come to georgia this days and you will see everything. And do not afraid. No one hurt you, as it was done a couple of hours ago in Tskhinvali with 2 georgian journalists: they were arrested and killed by Kokoev bandits only for the reason they were doing their job!

During first 2 todays russian TV programs and web sites were open for georgian. All the country were astonished with so much hate, lies and desinformation coming from russian mass-media. Then our officials decided to block them. And it was good decision.

According to officials about 30,000 refugees flee to north ossetia and this is real tragedy, but about the same amount flee to georgia. Why you russians ignore this and do not trouble their pains? During last conflict in Tskhinvali 50,000 refugees were cleaned and fleed from south ossetia. Why there pains don't trouble you? There are several reasons: first is russian propaganda (thanks to Putin which gains absolute control over mass-media in russia), second is what I already wrote - russians hate all the nations, especially caucasus nations and they know what I am talking about. Third and the most important, we all loose ability to feel each others pain. We lost love! Instead, territories, power, money, etc., are the most important for us.

I can not continue too much, but say you all one thing. Come to georgia and we will show you hundreds of documents claiming what genocide really is and what happened in Abkhazia. And it was done by russian citizens - cutting heads of murdered and playing footbal with it! And so on and so on.

I will continue after awhile...
#47
SiD Wrote:From Russian side it looks like that: Georgian forces started massive attack against South Osetia killing civilians and peacekeepers, using artilery and heavy weapons they are destroyng Tshinvali.
How else could Russia respond? Her people and soldiers were dying! And Georgian government knew it, if they didnt then, all i can say:it is hard to live without a brain.
Ask yourself if soldiers of your country were under massive assult (while maintaining peace according to international treaties) and assking for help would you approve immidiate millitary assistance?
And about Moscow teeth. U.S. and some other countries have already shown all the world that one who had no teeth will fall victim to the predators.

SiD, take a while, you will see our teeth...
Stating from the very beginning of this conflict when georgian troops only started to fight at the border of Tskhinvali, russian planes started bombing Tskhinvali region. What do their generals think, their bombs are so clever that do not kill civilians? After a day, when georgian troops pushed Kokoev bandits to north towards Java, what do you think they did not pass georgian villages there? Or may be georgian citizens disappeared with some magic? Time will come and we will show you real figures!!!

When Putin decided that he is loosing, he ordered to use all the military resources - 100s of tanks and artillery, 10ths of thousand of militaries, even tactic missiles. Greatest demonstration of power!!! We never doubt that all this conflicts are nothing to do with care over ossetians or abkhazians. Now we tiered out mask from russian monster!!! This is their face!!!

Now read the truth if you would like to understand something...

Russian peacekeepers should have done their job in the conflict zone, but from time to time south osetians attacked georgian villages in the region. There was no help from russian peacekeepers. They never protected georgians in the zone. This is the fact! Georgia intends to enter NATO, and this fact irritates Russia and they do everything to keep tense situation in the conflict zone. In the beginning of August separatists attacked georgian villages, georgians had to do their job! They entered the zone and protected the villages. Separatists opend the fire and georgians had to use their army not to let the separatists back to the villages. Later it was decided to enter the capital of South Osetia and the separatists ran away to Russia. They had no strength to fight without russian forces. By the way, the members of the south osetian government are Russian officials. This is no secret. The population of Souh Osetia is about 45 thousand people. About 30 thousand osetians and 15 000 georgians. Before the first war the georgian population was much more than today. Georgia has thousands of refugees. Osetians also live outside the conflict zone, in Georgia. Osetians came to Georgia from North Caucasus, their native land. And there was no national hatred between this two nations endeed. These two nations lived together for many years. In the past some of Georgian kings were Osetians by nationality and this two nations always fought together against muslim invaders and even russians! Stalin gave to this territory autonomy in the frames of Georgia, but after the collapse of The Soviet Union the autonomy declared independance and wonted to enter Russian Federation. Russia helped them with their weapon, and made Georgians run from the capital Tskhinvali. Today there are Osetians who want to live with Georgians, even some of the people who fought against Georgia in the past. But Russians always had their plans over this situation and always did everything to make these two nations enemies. Today there are hundreds of russian tanks in the conflict zone. Russian army is fighting against Georgians, there are no more separatists in the zone. Russia bombed several Georgian cities and killed peaceful civilians. Russians say that Georgians destroyed south osetian capital Tskhinvali, but this is not true. When Georgian army entered Tskhinvali russian aviation and army began to bomb the city to drive georgian troops out. Russians destroyd the city.
#48
by Tim
Your words absurdity even because even such small people as South Ossetia asked us about the help while the Georgian soldiers marauded in streets Tshenvali.... At you and your president love to a genocide... I wait when you will be responsible for those killed children, old men and women... Which you pressed tanks! And now try to remain pure before all the world! You have begun storm of sleeping city in day of Opening of Olympic Games.... You not people and animals!

by ahealen
Genocide in the Chechen Republic? About what you? To Russian soldiers cut heads.... What genocide... There there was an international gangsterism, capture of hospital in Kizlyar on JANUARY, 9TH, 1996. The group of the Chechen insurgents under Salmana Raduev's command has grasped hospital in the city of Kizlyar. Or on JUNE, 14TH, 1995 - CAPTURE of HOSPITAL In Budyonnovsk. For six day 129 peace inhabitants have been killed, 415 person have received wounds, a mutilation. You speak about what genocide! It is a current two examples.
Much you know in the Europe, it is more than Russian, sit in the Europe and judge Russian... As if there were!
#49
Remember history of russia and you will decide something about animals.

Just a seconds ago your planes fall bombs over Tbilisi. 500 meters from my home. You are pigs, all russians!!!!

Only one fact from, our history I would like to tell you but, rather to stop talking with you. No sense to speak with animals!!!
#50
Tim Wrote:
SiD Wrote:From Russian side it looks like that: Georgian forces started massive attack against South Osetia killing civilians and peacekeepers, using artilery and heavy weapons they are destroyng Tshinvali.
How else could Russia respond? Her people and soldiers were dying! And Georgian government knew it, if they didnt then, all i can say:it is hard to live without a brain.
Ask yourself if soldiers of your country were under massive assult (while maintaining peace according to international treaties) and assking for help would you approve immidiate millitary assistance?
And about Moscow teeth. U.S. and some other countries have already shown all the world that one who had no teeth will fall victim to the predators.

SiD, take a while, you will see our teeth...
Stating from the very beginning of this conflict when georgian troops only started to fight at the border of Tskhinvali, russian planes started bombing Tskhinvali region. What do their generals think, their bombs are so clever that do not kill civilians? After a day, when georgian troops pushed Kokoev bandits to north towards Java, what do you think they did not pass georgian villages there? Or may be georgian citizens disappeared with some magic? Time will come and we will show you real figures!!!

When Putin decided that he is loosing, he ordered to use all the military resources - 100s of tanks and artillery, 10ths of thousand of militaries, even tactic missiles. Greatest demonstration of power!!! We never doubt that all this conflicts are nothing to do with care over ossetians or abkhazians. Now we tiered out mask from russian monster!!! This is their face!!!

Now read the truth if you would like to understand something...

Russian peacekeepers should have done their job in the conflict zone, but from time to time south osetians attacked georgian villages in the region. There was no help from russian peacekeepers. They never protected georgians in the zone. This is the fact! Georgia intends to enter NATO, and this fact irritates Russia and they do everything to keep tense situation in the conflict zone. In the beginning of August separatists attacked georgian villages, georgians had to do their job! They entered the zone and protected the villages. Separatists opend the fire and georgians had to use their army not to let the separatists back to the villages. Later it was decided to enter the capital of South Osetia and the separatists ran away to Russia. They had no strength to fight without russian forces. By the way, the members of the south osetian government are Russian officials. This is no secret. The population of Souh Osetia is about 45 thousand people. About 30 thousand osetians and 15 000 georgians. Before the first war the georgian population was much more than today. Georgia has thousands of refugees. Osetians also live outside the conflict zone, in Georgia. Osetians came to Georgia from North Caucasus, their native land. And there was no national hatred between this two nations endeed. These two nations lived together for many years. In the past some of Georgian kings were Osetians by nationality and this two nations always fought together against muslim invaders and even russians! Stalin gave to this territory autonomy in the frames of Georgia, but after the collapse of The Soviet Union the autonomy declared independance and wonted to enter Russian Federation. Russia helped them with their weapon, and made Georgians run from the capital Tskhinvali. Today there are Osetians who want to live with Georgians, even some of the people who fought against Georgia in the past. But Russians always had their plans over this situation and always did everything to make these two nations enemies. Today there are hundreds of russian tanks in the conflict zone. Russian army is fighting against Georgians, there are no more separatists in the zone. Russia bombed several Georgian cities and killed peaceful civilians. Russians say that Georgians destroyed south osetian capital Tskhinvali, but this is not true. When Georgian army entered Tskhinvali russian aviation and army began to bomb the city to drive georgian troops out. Russians destroyd the city.

Full bosh and lies.... You try to blacken Russia, sometime the truth will triumph. Your mass media speak not the truth, your authority is military criminals which have made massacre of people in South Ossetia who in it does not trust come here and esteem http: // cominf.org/ it is a site of South Ossetia... Think, what for to peace people to say lies.
Words of mister Tim do not coincide with the validity if as he said Russia has attacked South Ossetia... That as South Ossetia could open fire in general on territories of Georgia, in fact you simply impudently say lies.
Then South Ossetia would be protected from Russia, and shot across Georgia but for such small republic it is not real.


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