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Kosovo and Metohija is part of Serbia since 9 century.
And it 'll be forever!!!
Albanians OUT!!!

Jovan82 Wrote:Kosovo and Metohija is part of Serbia since 9 century.
And it 'll be forever!!!
Albanians OUT!!!

Well Jovan I'm ashamed of you and all serbian chetnik's. Please let Kosovo go and take look into our yard is fully with sh... If you think just like that you can get OUT one nation than this is not only stupid but is damnific and harmful for us serbians too. Please don't count on me to follow the stupid primeminister Kostunica and war criminals like Seselj & co. I'm pride to be serbian but i dont know how long will last this if you continue in this way....

yes

for Kosovo

Jovan82 Wrote:Kosovo and Metohija is part of Serbia since 9 century.

It had to be much earlier,dear Jovan.
In 9. century Serbia was very wide state..
Carlo the Great was very afraid of Serbs>In 805.he made Limes sorabicus.. In 807.he said> If Czechs attack us, we will use third of army..But, if Serbs attack us, we have to mibilise the whole our army..


Look the map taken from The Public Schools Historical Atlas ,edited by C. Colbeck, published by Longmans, Green, and Co. 1905. , with tittle Europe 814.. you will see border of serbia and alarmant missing of any albanian in european region ..
They came to Balcan in 11.century, from Sicily..Like tragedy to all christian people.



Albanian homeland is in Caucauss....


Белградбој је Арнаут , прескочите његове коментаре.

My maps are cutted, sorry..Too big format.

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/76/Europe_814.jpg">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... pe_814.jpg</a><!-- m -->

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.dejanlucic.net/cirilica/images/top3-2.gif">http://www.dejanlucic.net/cirilica/images/top3-2.gif</a><!-- m -->

Now AuLona will speak....as always.

But I remember a Country that also became Independent 5 years ago, just like KosovO they claimed independance, and what is happening now?
They are beging their home Country that they become part of it.

But i don't think Serbia will let that happen.

When Albania Become Big Albania, the world will have enough....I Am 100% sure that Georgia, wich is Orthodox, by the way would become a member of the EU that Kosovo-------> Big Albania, but don't worry the world will be a mess again thanks to you, just what you wanted, eh?

And the USA are falling it is time for a new world leader, wich will be:
China,
Russia or
India.

Can't wait to see the faces of Albanians, when their beloved America (wich 3/4 of people don't know on wich Continent Albania is) falls down and then the revenge will come without force.

You will see how it is when the whole world thinks that you are a Scum-nation Just because of Individuals...

We Will See Who will Party then.


Now AuLona will speak....as always.

Now AuLona will speak....as always.

But I remember a Country that also became Independent 5 years ago, just like KosovO they claimed independance, and what is happening now?
They are beging their home Country that they become part of it.

But i don't think Serbia will let that happen.

When Albania Become Big Albania, the world will have enough....I Am 100% sure that Georgia, wich is Orthodox, by the way would become a member of the eariler EU than Kosovo-------> Big Albania, but don't worry the world will be a mess again thanks to you, just what you wanted, eh?

And the USA are falling it is time for a new world leader, wich will be:
China,
Russia or
India.

Can't wait to see the faces of Albanians, when their beloved America (wich 3/4 of people don't know on wich Continent Albania is) falls down and then the revenge will come without force.

You will see how it is when the whole world thinks that you are a Scum-nation Just because of Individuals...

We Will See Who will Party then.


Now AuLona will speak....as always

OK, as for Kosovo's independence, I wanna say I'm not in favor.
Mainly because this is an illegal partition of Serbia, without any doubts.
EU simply trampled on UN Charter and other international treaties, so why do we have all those lows than? What for?
I feel like no matter how valid Serbia's arguments are (and this is actually some of the rare cases that Serbia has right over something), nobody cares about it and nobody shows any respect for it.

How I see the whole situation: several months/years from now on...EU will be forced to deal the reality that no self-respecting country would willingly accept loss of part of its territory through an illegality.
With all due respect, there can't be stability or peace if one ethnic group (Albanians) is encouraged and got everything they asked for and the other group (Serbs) lost everything and pushed behind. This unilateral declaration of independence is far from being fair, moral or democratic.
At the end, negotiations will have to be continued, but the fair negotiations. Until now, Serbs constantly had been asked to reach out and offer the independence, which is simply unbelievable.
I'm amazed how many countries in Europe misses the whole point or ignore the problem.
Everyone happy? Well, not really...

And one more thing, I haven't read all the posts in this forum, it would take too much time. I just wanted to write down my opinion, so... if anyone got annoyed or insulted by my comment, I apologize.
I would also like to ask kindly other people to write without insulting others, without (ultra) nationalistic and barbarian vocabulary, in atmosphere of tolerance and respect for all. Please avoid fights, just real arguments and tolerance.

The atrocities of 1912





And their fate after becoming prisoners(not by war)

According to Cubrilovic, Royal Yugoslavia could achieve
political stability through two parallel processes:

1.Serbian colonization of lands with non-Serbian population and
2.Expulsion of some nationalities from the country.

The results of the Serbian colonization until 1937 were not satisfactory,
said Cubrilovic.

Nonetheless, the Serbian Academician saw the Albanians as the most dangerous nationality. They should be expelled to Albania and Turkey. The expulsion of the Albanians from Yugoslavia would solve at the same time the problem of the fifth "dangerous" nationality, Slavic Muslims: "With the removal of the Albanians, the last link between our Muslims in Bosnia and Novi Pazar and the rest of the Muslim world is cut" (p. 110). Cubrilovic was aware of the difficulty of the task. The few successes already achieved in colonization he
saw as the result not of good organization, but rather of the "colonizing qualities of our race [nase rase]" (p. 117). Since the gradual colonization of Kosovo was not a solution:

It is impossible to repulse the Albanians only by means of
gradual colonization [...], the only way and the only means to
cope with them is the brutal force of organized state power
[brutalna sila jedne organizovane drzavne vlasti] in which we
have always been superior to them. (p. 111)

AND THEY REPETEAD AGAIN IN 1999.
(PS.I think this thread must be sticky)


And they used every method from most barbaric to most "educated"

Instead of "Western methods", Cubrilovic argues for "oriental
methods" in solving the Albanian question in Kosovo:

When it comes to religious issues, the Albanians are very
touchy, therefore they must be harassed on this score too.
This can be achieved through ill-treatment of their clergy,
the destruction of their graveyards [...]. We should
distribute weapons to our colonists, as need be. In those
regions, the old Chetnik action should be organized and
secretly assisted. In particular, a tide of Montenegrins
should be launched from the hills, in order to create large-
scale conflict with the Albanians in Metohija. This conflict
should be prepared by our trusted people: It should bc
encouraged and this can be done more easily since the
Albanians have revolted, while the whole affair should be
presented with peace in our hearts as a conflict between clans
and tribes and, if need be, ascribed to economic reasons. In
an extreme necessity, these will be bloodily suppressed
with the most effective means by colonists, Montenegrin tribes
and the Chetniks, rather than by the Army. There is one more
means which Serbia used with great practical effect after
1878, secretly burning down Albanian villages and city
quarters. (pp. 113-114)

Cubrilovic supposed that Europe with its Western standards
would probably criticize these "oriental methods." But he had
a prepared Realpolitical reply:

[T]he world today has grown used to things much worse than
this and is so preoccupied with day-to-day problems that this
aspect should not be a cause for concern. At a time when
Germany can expel tens of thousands of Jews and Russia can
shift millions of people from one part of the continent to
another, the expulsion of few hundred thousand Albanians
will not lead to the outbreak of a world war. (p. 112)

The most respected scholarly organizations in Serbia, the
Royal Serbian Academy of Sciences and the University of
Belgrade, "ought to take the initiative to organize a thorough
scholarly study of the whole problem of colonization in our
country." Realization of the colonization "should be entrusted
to the main General Staff. Here is why. For pure reasons of
national defense" (p. 118). The Army had a vital role in
colonization.
During the setting up of new colonies, military forces should
be used where required... For this job, the Army should be
given the right and possibility of creating a kind of
obligatory labor duty for public purposes, just as Stamboliski
did in Bulgaria (Trudova povinost) and Hitler in Germany
(Arbeitsdienst) by calling up reservists for military training
or extending the term of military service. (p. 122)

Jovan Raskovic, psychiatrist and leader of the Serbian
Democratic Party in Croatia, announced in Belgrade two years
ago that the Serbian people may even make war against the
other peoples of former Yugoslavia, but that this would be to
the benefit (!) of the other peoples:

However stupid that might appear: the Serbian people,
according to the state of things today, will go on carrying.
out, if not wars, then that liberating thought which will be
directed towards other peoples, as a contribution to them and
for their own good.

("42 aplauza za Jovana Raskovica", Duga, May 26 - June 8,
1990, p. 20.)

These declarations of war and cleansing the non-Serbian
population of other republics sprang from the real assumption
that the Yugoslav People's Army would carry out the war and
clean up the territory of other republics. The Serbian
conception felt that military might could and should resolve
all the open political questions of the existence of former
Yugoslavia.

In distinction from the Serbian conception, Tudjman started
with the necessity of respecting political rights and the will
of the citizens of all the republics of former Yugoslavia,
including their right to their own state. Tudjman was against
military might as a forcibly imposed arbiter in political
questions. He supported an independent and sovereign Croatia,
but he wanted to achieve it, if possible, through a
confederation of sovereign states or, if that were impossible,
through dissociation by agreement and not by war. However,
the other side did not accept either a confederation or
dissociation by agreement and threatened to crush the
disobedient republic with military force. Tudjman responded
with a call to the citizens of Croatia for a referendum, in
which the Croats declared their support for a free and
independent Republic of Croatia. The other side, the
Serbian-led Yugoslav Army, responded with military aggression
against Croatia. The leadership of Croatia, headed by Tudjman,
found itself in an extremely difficult position: a militarily
superior aggressor was taking over Croatian territory; Croatia
could not arm itself because of the U.N. embargo on weapons;
the international community did not send peace-keeping forces
to Croatia; the European Community did not recognize the
independence of the Republic, while within Croatia itself some
elements were working against the attainment of independence.
While the other side relied on military force and the
passivity of the international community, Tudjman acted on
both levels: both on the international political stage and on
the battlefields of Croatia. Tudjman's government agreed to
numerous cease-fires (which the enemy immediately violated),
but this was a way of demonstrating to the international
community who was continuing the war by violating the
cease-fires, and who wanted peace.

On January 15, 1927 the European Community recognized the
independence of Croatia within its pre-war boundaries. In this
way, Tudjman achieved the strategic goal of the Croatian
political conception: the independence of Croatia. The Greater
Serbian conception (along with some tactical successes)
suffered a double strategic defeat: both military and
political. One of the best-prepared European armies needed all
of three months, with enormous casualties of its own, to
conquer the ruins of one city, Vukovar. This could not be
called a brilliant military victory but rather the incapacity
to conquer all of Croatia. The cities of Osijek, Vinkovci,
Pakrac, Sisak, Karlovac, Zadar, Dubrovnik and so on have been
bombarded but not occupied. And these cities, indeed, were
included into the planned Greater Serbia.

The political defeat of the Greater Serbian idea is even more
severe: international condemnation of aggression and the
introduction of sanctions against Serbia.

And so it would seem that the author of Wilderness had a
better sense of history and human justice than the authors of
the 1986 "Memorandum" of the Serbian Academy of Sciences and
Arts, in which the plans of the acquisition of Greater Serbia
were delineated.

Cubrilovic first presented his ideas to the Serbian Cultural Club, an organization of Belgrade intellectuals. On March 7,1937, he submitted "The Expulsion of the Albanians" to the government as a secret memorandum. "From 1918 onwards it was the task of our present state to destroy the remainder of the Albanian triangle [Kosova]. It did not do this, Cubrilovic wrote. "The only way and the only means to cope with them is the brute force of an organized state." Cubrilovic suggested that Albania and Turkey would be the best places to ship Kosovar Albanians. But, if Tirana objected to the deportation, "the Albanian Government should be informed that we shall stop at nothing to achieve our final solution to this question." Cubrilovic explained that "to bring about the relocation of a whole population, the first prerequisite is the creation of the suitable psychosis.’ This, he said, .can be created in many ways’ "including bribing and threatening the Albanian clergy, propaganda, and "coercion by the state apparatus," a concept he explained at length:

The law must be enforced to the letter so as to make staying intolerable for the Albanians: fines, and imprisonment, the ruthless application of all police dispositions, such as the prohibition of smuggling, cutting forests, damaging agriculture, leaving dogs unchained, compulsory labor and any other measure that an experienced police force can contrive. >From the Economic aspect: The refusal to recognize the old land deeds,... requisitioning of all state and communal pastures,... the withdrawal of permits to exercise a profession, dismissal from the state, private and communal offices, etc., will hasten the process of their removal.... When it comes to religion the Albanians are very touchy, therefore they must be harassed on this score, too. This can be achieved through ill-treatment of their clergy, the destruction of their clergy, the destruction of their cemeteries, the prohibition of polygamy, and especially the inflexible application of the law compelling girls to attend elementary schools, wherever they are .... We should distribute weapons to our colonists, as need be.... In particular, a tide of Montenegrins should be launched from the mountain pastures in order to create a large-scale conflict with the Albanians in [Kosova]. This conflict should be prepared by means of our trusted people. It should be encouraged and this can be done more easily since, in fact, Albanians have revolted, while the whole affair should be presented as a conflict between clans and, if need be, ascribed to economic reasons. Finally, local riots can be incited. These will be bloodily suppressed with the most effective means.... There remains one more means, which Serbia employed with great practical effect after 1878, that is, by secretly burning down villages and city quarters.

"My first thought when I read [Cubrilovic’s 1937 memo]," says Charles Jelavich, a professor emeritus of history at Indiana University and an acquaintance of Cubrilovies since 1949, "was, my God, I think Milosevic read this and said, "I’m going to implement this plan." Still, some Slavic studies scholars and former acquaintances of Cubrilovic argue that, in light of what was happening in Europe and Russia in the 30’s, this ghastly vision was not as extreme as it sounds today. "I think most of these things should be put in the proper context," says Bosko Spasojevic of the Open Society Institute in Budapest, who was once a teaching assistant at Belgrade University, where he knew Cubrilovic. "At that time in Europe things like this were solved in very radical, cruel ways" Indeed, Cubrilovic wrote: "The world today has grown used to things much worse than this, and it should not be a cause for concern. At a time when Germany can expel tens of thousands of Jews and Russia can shift millions of people from one part of the continent to another, the shifting of a few hundred thousand Albanians will not lead to the outbreak of a world war."

Although parts of Cubrilovic’s plan were put into effect during the 30’s, World War II temporarily interrupted any mass deportation. But, after Soviet troops liberated Belgrade in late 1944, Cubrilovic, who spent part of the war in a German prison camp, submitted another plan to Yugoslavia’s new Communist leader, Josip Broz Tito. This second document, "The Minority Problem in the New Yugoslavia," advocated the expulsion of not just Kosovar Albanians but all of Yugoslavia’s minorities. "Yugoslavia can achieve peace and ensure development only if it becomes ethnically pure" he wrote. The army should "systematically and without mercy cleanse the minorities of these regions, which we want to settle with our own national element." He advocated taking advantage of the war chaos to help "ethnically conquer" Kosova: "That which in peaceful times takes decades and centuries in time of war will be accomplished in a matter of months and years." He also called for concentration camps, the development of a complicated government bureaucracy to conduct ethnic cleansing, and stressed that "[t]he hatred and irresistible wish of our masses to do away with minorities must be utilized in a constructive way," for "[i]t may be that we might never again have such an opportunity in order to make our state ethnically pure."

It tells you something about the sincerity of Tito’s "brotherhood and unity" slogan that he invited Cubrilovic to serve as a federal minister from 1945 to 1951. During this period, the Tito government did send tens of thousands of Albanians to Turkey and, according to some estimates, executed tens of thousands more.

Yet some say that, by the time of his death in 1990, Cubrilovic had mellowed and no longer believed in the brutal solutions he had once advocated. "I think he was afraid of what [post-Tito nationalism] would unleash, " says Norman Cigar, who is completing a study of the infamous 1986 Memorandum of the Serbian Academy of Arts and Sciences, the intellectuals’ manifesto that became the inspiration for Milosevic-era Serbian nationalism. "He was dead against the memo’ "says Cigar. "He said it was going to lead to bloodshed " However, at the same time Cubrilovic was predicting that the memorandum would break up Yugoslavia, he also threatened that blood would be spilled if Kosovar Albanians sought independence.

Whatever intellectual shifts he may have gone through at the end of his life, Cubrilovic had created an ideological monster he could no longer control. Shortly after his death, The Collected Historical Studies by Vasa Cubrilovic was trotted out by nationalist Serbs to bolster the case for the wars that Milosevic later launched.

Confronted today with more than half a million deportees and reports of unspeakable violence, many in the West wonder at the lack of dissent among Serbian intellectuals. But, as Cubrilovic’s work shows, the historical rationale for ethnic cleansing has been provided by some of the most respected academics in Serbia. The present generation of Belgrade scholars is hardly different. As Miranda Vickers, the author of Between Serb and Albanian, puts it, "The more educated the Serbs are, the more nationalist they become."

During the Milosevic era, Dusan Batakovic, a Belgrade University historian, has emerged as the leading advocate for the minority Serb population in Kosova. Like many nationalist writers, though, his scholarship seems clouded by a wildly chauvinistic reading of Serbian history. He notes that the Kosovar Albanian intelligentsia consists of "semi-intellectuals capable of taking in only a limited number of ideas. " He writes that during World War II some 100,000 Albanians immigrated to Kosova under a secret Italian resettlement policy. (The Axis powers occupied Albania during the war.) In Kosova: A Short History, however, Noel Malcolm exposes this assertion as "pure fantasy." He writes, "No evidence of any such mass migration during the war can be found in any of the documents of the occupying powers’

Writing about the deportation of Kosovars to Turkey in theories, Batakovic insists that mainly ethnic Mirks were sent and that the number of Albanians was "negligible. " He fails to mention that, before the deportation, Albanians were coerced into declaring themselves as Turks (the number of "Turks" in Kosova increased by 2,500 percent in six years). Today, this spurious "researcher" is a widely respected historian, and it is said he will likely follow in Cubrilovic’s footsteps and be named director of the Institute for Balkan Studies.

Yet Cubrilovic’s true legacy may be what is now happening in Kosova the enactment of his decades-old blueprint for ethnic cleansing through Milosevic’s meticulously planned Operation Horseshoe. "NATO didn’t realize that this ‘Cubrilovic syndrome of the 1930s was still active in the 1990s, says Vickers. "But the Serbs have always said, "We don't"

‘Etnicko Ciscenje Kosova sesti je val zlocina Srba nad Albancima u stotinu godina’

Vecernji list, April 27, 1999, p. 17.

ETHNIC CLEANSING OF KOSOVO IS SIXTH WAVE OF CRIME AGAINST ALBANIANS IN 100 YEARS

ZAGREB - As much as people do not like to hear it, the worst victims of NATO attacks against FRY are the Kosovo Albanians. The reason for this is that Milosevic is taking advantage of a state of war to finish the plan of ethnically cleansing Kosovo of Albanians, as was planned by ‘Greater Serbian’ ideologists a long time ago. Close to 600 thousand Albanians have already fled Kosovo over the last month, while tens of thousands are still hiding in the mountains of Kosovo in search of safer routes toward the southern border.

Though the Belgrade regime probably realises it will, in the end, lose the war and that it will have to unconditionally agree to the return of refugees, as well as a probable international protectorate in Kosovo, it still has the goal of preventing at least some of the Albanians from returning to Kosovo.

That is how the Kosovo myth about the region being the ‘birthplace of Serbism’ - although it stopped being just that after the failed uprising against the Turks at the end of the 17th century - continues to be a source of inspiration in the present day.

Generations of Serbian politicians and intellectuals have created plans for the final solution to this problem, not hiding their hegemonism and aggressive chauvinism based on religious, cultural and even racist prejudices. Experts who deal with the history of Kosovo have no doubts that the genocidal policies toward Kosovo Albanians have been obvious since 1878, when Serbia and Montenegro were internationally formally recognised, in spite of their defeat from the Turks and thanks to Russian diplomacy and the Berlin Conference.

‘DENSE ALBANIAN VILLAGES’ CONQUERED ONE BY ONE

Seeing as the Albanians used to live in present day southern Serbia, the direct consequence of that fact was their brutal expulsion from the wider vicinities of Nis, Pirot, Palanka, Leskovac and Vranje. Serbian historians attempted to portray that exodus as voluntary moving, to spite some other later writers who wrote of the authorities after 1878 secretly torching villages and Albanian quarters in cities. It is difficult to talk about any precise numbers, primarily due to the fact the Serbian authorities back failed to conduct a census, but it is presumed that no less than 30,000 Albanians were expelled from Serbia. Some of them moved to Kosovo, which was not under Serbian rule at the time, while others settled in Asia Minor and other areas of the Ottoman Empire. What was actually happening at that time can be seen through a text by Vasa Cubrilovic - a participant in the assassination of the Austro-Hungarian heir to the throne, Franjo Ferdinand, in Sarajevo - who later became an ideologist of genocide against the Albanians. Here is a quote from Cubrilovic from Ljubica Stefan’s book ‘Serbs and Albanians’ (three volumes), which had to be published in Ljubljana without an author’s name, due to the political psychosis in 1989.

"The moment the first Serbian units began their penetration toward Kursumlija, Prokuplje and Leskovac, they came across densely grouped Albanian villages that refused to surrender. They will be the central point of Serbian battles. Village by village had to be taken. The Albanians retreated toward the south, hiding in refugee camps and continued to fight. When the Serbian Army would approach refugee camps, they would retreat toward the South Morava Valleys, Veternica, Medvedje, Pusta Reka and Laba, then further on to Kosovo… After 1878, Serbia had to colonise the regions abandoned by the Albanians and Turks. The border with Kosovo had to be settled with nationally loyal residents in order for the border with the Albanians to be secure."

RESPONSIBILITY FOR ‘SERBIAN MISFORTUNE’

A new wave of crimes against the Albanians, this time in Kosovo and in western regions of Macedonia, began in the first of the Balkan wars, when the Serbs and Montenegrins - assisted by the Bulgarians and Greeks - expelled Turkey from the Balkans. In an analysis of the Serbian press of the period, Ljubica Stefan noticed the leader of the murders and expulsions of Albanians was the Serbian Orthodox Church, that sent Serbian soldiers to battle with the slogan "avenge Kosovo!" That is how Albanians ended up bearing the burden of blame for the "Serbian misfortune" on religious grounds, though they were also rebelling against the Sultan for their own independence. Serbs and Montenegrins at the time were not too interested in Kosovo, rather in the northern part of Albania, especially the regions surrounding Skadar and Drac. Belgrade and Cetinja reached their goal, but had to leave those regions due to the pressure of the world powers of the time. At the 1913 London Conference an independent Albania was created with borders almost identical to the ones existing today.

The total figures for Serbian and Montenegrin army crimes, who’s countries divided Kosovo between themselves, were never published. Judging by individual reports from the field, which was often written by the leader of the Serbian Social Democratic Party, Dimitrije Tucovic, tens of thousands of Albanians were massacred, in addition to masses of displaced persons.

"WHOEVER SURVIVES TO NIGHTFALL…"

A Tucovic text, with an indicative title - ‘Blood Revenge for Wild Soldiers’ - includes descriptions such as the following:

"The ghost of death hung over the heads of Pec, Djakovica and Prizren Albanians day and night. Whoever survived to nightfall was not sure to see the next sunrise… With the fall of Kumanovo, the entire Albanian population, which was being pushed by the Serbian Army coming in from the north, flocked to Skopje in hope of finding sanctuary. Most found death instead."

At the time there were also a lot of forceful baptisms of Muslim Albanians to the Serbian Orthodox faith and the Catholic priest from Djakovica warned his bishop that the Montenegrin authorities are forcing both Albanians and Catholics to embrace the Orthodox religion. When the world powers demanded the Belgrade authorities recognise basic civil and religious rights for Albanians, Nikola Pasic angrily replied, "Serbia cannot agree to that demand because it is in opposition to the right to state sovereignty." It is interesting that the Milosevic regime today is using the same arguments to camouflage their crimes.


After the Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes (SHS) was created, the Albanian position did not get any better and that was the time when the actual colonisation of Kosovo began. The first cycle of colonisation of Serbian ‘Salonikans’ and Montenegrins was staged between 1922 and 1929, and the other was between 1933 and 1938. Belgrade sources admit the arrival of 12 thousand colonial families to Kosovo, which could mean some 60 thousand people. It is presumed that some of those people shared their land or there was no official record of any other new arrivals because in the end there were "34,528 agricultural units with land." They received land confiscated through the agricultural reforms, as well as the majority of municipal land and private property that was owned primarily by expelled Albanians. The confiscation of parts or all Albanian land, according to post-war revisions of the communist authorities, 6,342 Albanian families suffered damages.

The methods implemented in the colonisation in the field between the two world wars, is best testified by one Serbian colonist from the Prizren area:

"There were many cases where Serbs were given land, orchards or fields, owned by Albanians, outside of a limited complex, from the authorities. The Albanians received no compensation in money or land. Every Serb with less than 10 hectares could receive an additional 10 hectares from the authorities. All that had to be done was to go to the authorities and say: "I want you to give me this or that orchard that belongs to this or that Albanian because I have less than 10 hectares," and the authorities would give it to the Serb requesting it."

OTHER METHODS: FINES, ARRESTS, TAXES…

It has been estimated that only up to 1921 some 40 thousand Kosovo Albanians fled to Albania because of state terror. However, in the period between the wars, the population in Kosovo was still 66 percent in favour of Albanians, as opposed to Serbs and Montenegrin who could only ‘muster up’ 22 percent.

Not even the drastic methods of political and economic pressures did not satisfy Belgrade political and intellectual circles. The Serbian Cultural Circle, the brain of ‘Greater Serbianism’ of that time, organised on March 7, 1937, a debate on the Kosovo question. The officer in charge was the respected historian Vasa Cubrilovic and the topic of the debate was ‘Eviction of Albanians’. The point of his deliberation was to motivate a complete cleansing of Albanians from Kosovo, using all possible methods ranging from the agreement with the Turks on accepting emigrants to the most brutal methods of terrorism and crime:

"The other method would be pressure on the state authorities. They should use the laws to their limits in order to make the survival of Albanians in our land very bitter: fines, arrests, merciless implementation of all police regulations… merciless tax collection and all public and private debts, confiscation of state grazing pastures… The Albanians are the most sensitive concerning religion, hence they should be touched where they hurt the most. This can be achieved by harassing their clergy, clearing cemeteries, forbidding polygamy… The displacement of villages has to be a priority, as well as in the cities. The villages are more stable, hence are more dangerous. After that, we should not make the mistake of only expelling the poor."

The development of Cubrilovic’s theories was entrusted to Ivo Andric in 1939, who was the Yugoslav deputy foreign minister at that time. He put the displacement of Albanians in an international context, which was to be used in further talks with Turkey, while the most important Yugoslav goal was to divide Albania with Mussolini, in order for the Kosovo Albanians to be assimilated more easily.

Cubrilovic joined the communist authorities in 1944 as a minister, but did not relinquish his theories, which he reiterated, but this time in the form of fear that the Albanian element, "which was opposed to the old Yugoslavia, will also be opposed to the new one." That document was kept under lock and key for decades in the Belgrade military archive.

In the final battles to liberate Yugoslavia, tens of thousands of young Albanians were forcefully drafted for military service and used as cannon fodder on the Srijem (Sirmium) Front. An example was recorded and was mentioned by Aleksandar Rankovic in 1945, when an Albanian killed his superior (Serbian) officer. 300 novice soldiers (Albanians) were immediately massacred.

In the mid-sixties, just before the fall of Rankovic, every third employee in Kosovo was a Montenegrin, every fourth was a Serb and every seventeenth was an Albanian. When Milosevic cancelled Kosovo autonomy in 1989, in a very short period some 150,000 Albanians were dismissed from work. Only "honest Albanians" - i.e. Serb obedient Albanians - were able to keep their public and national company jobs.

In the post war period, the pressures to evict Albanians continued, especially through economic measures, as well as political and legal persecution, in principle, against the "Albanian irredenta." In the eighties, 3,340 Albanians were jailed for alleged political crimes, while another 10,000 were prosecuted and convicted of criminal acts. The former were sentenced to over seven years, or a total of 23,400 years imprisonment in total for all of those sentenced. The latter, mostly younger people, were sentenced to a total of 25,000 years imprisonment. According to those figures, the former Yugoslav federation was the record holder in Europe. Furthermore, up to the beginning of the open conflict in Kosovo, 223 Albanians were killed during police operations.

1944
Vaso Cubrilovic:
The Minority Problem in the New Yugoslavia: Memorandum
"The Minority Problem in the New Yugoslavia," is a second memorandum on the Albanians (and other minorities) written by the noted Bosnian Serb scholar and political figure Vaso Cubrilovic (1897-1990). As a student in 1914, Cubrilovic had participated in the assassination in Sarajevo of Archduke Ferdinand of Austria-Hungary, the event which precipitated the First World War. Between the two wars, he was professor at the Faculty of Arts in Belgrade. A leading member of the Serbian Academy of Sciences and Art, Cubrilovic also held several ministerial portfolios after World War II. Among his writings is the monograph "Istorija politicke misle u Srbiji XIX veka," Belgrade 1958 (History of political thought in Serbia in the 19th century).


We must be more straightforward and practical in dealing with the Albanians in Old Serbia (Kosovo) and Macedonia in order to conquer Kosovo and Metohija ethnically and, at the same time, avoid a conflict with the neighbouring people in Albania. We must also take great care in considering the areas from which Albanians should be expelled and resettled so as not to affect a single Albanian village, indeed a single Albanian home more than necessary. If we are to reach our goal of linking Montenegro, Serbia and Macedonia, we must bring about a complete change in the ethnic structure of Kosovo and Metohija. Most important of all, we must cleanse Metohija. As the border region to neighbouring Montenegro, it will be most suitable for Montenegrin colonization. After all, the Metohija and Drenica Albanians are at present the most loyal servants of the Germans, as they were a few years ago of the Italians. Dreadful atrocities were committed by the Albanians in the Macedonian villages of the upper Vardar valley. The Macedonians, therefore, rightfully demand their expulsion. A detailed plan must be elaborated to specify with accuracy which villages and areas of Old Serbia (Kosovo) and Macedonia are to be cleansed, and the plan must be implemented accordingly.
In principle, we would have nothing against the evacuation of all minorities from our country. This is something we can still consider. The above-mentioned points in the Vojvodina, Slovenia, Old Serbia (Kosovo) and Macedonia constitute simply a minimum if we want to ensure future possession of these regions.
If we agree in principle that the minority problem can only be solved through expulsion, and that expulsions should be carried out as proposed above, we are then faced with the problem of how this is to be accomplished.
The first thing I would like to mention in this connection is that wars are most suitable for solving such problems. Like storms, they blow through countries, uprooting and blotting out peoples. What takes decades and centuries to accomplish in peaceful times, can be accomplished within a matter of months and years in a war. Let us not delude ourselves. If we wish to solve this problem, we will only be able to do so during the war. The leaders of old Yugoslavia thought after 1918 that they could break down the major ethnic blocks in the country by colonization. We have wasted billions of dinars on settling volunteers and other colonists throughout the Vojvodina, Kosovo and Metohija. In the Vojvodina over a twenty year period, we managed to change the ethnic balance in our favour by a few percentage points, but the German and Hungarian minorities still remain in Backa. From 1918 to 1938, the Albanians increased their numbers in Kosovo and Metohija more by natural growth than we were able to do by bringing in settlers. Driving our colonists out of Backa, Kosovo and Metohija, the Hungarians and Albanians were thus able to cancel out the few results we obtained. In order to prevent this from happening again, the army must be brought in, even during the war, to cleanse the regions we wish to settle with our own people, doing so in a well-planned but ruthless manner. I do not yet wish to discuss details as to how this should be accomplished but, should this project be approved in principle, I would be more than willing to make my knowledge and experience available to the Supreme Command, to the National Liberation Army and to the partisan units in order to work out a more detailed plan. For the moment, I wish only to stress that the Germans and Hungarians must be expelled unconditionally from their lands in the Vojvodina, and the Albanians must be driven out of Metohija, Kosovo and Polog.
Aside from ethnic cleansing during military operations, other methods must be applied to force the national minorities out. In view of their behaviour during the war, they must be stripped of all minority rights. All members of national minorities who were in any way of service to the occupants should be brought before military tribunals and shown no mercy. Concentration camps should be set up for them, their property confiscated, their families placed likewise in concentrations camps and, at the first opportunity, they should be expelled to their national states. The fraternal Soviet Army could be of enormous assistance in this question in dealing with the Hungarians and Germans. In expelling minorities, particular attention should be devoted to the intelligentsia and to the wealthiest strata of society. These are the people who behaved the worst towards us, serving the occupants loyally, and these are the elements who will be the most dangerous if they are allowed to remain in their native regions. The poor workers and peasants were not particularly sympathetic to German and Hungarian fascism and should not be persecuted. The same applies to Albanian beys and the Albanian bourgeoisie. Those same people who served the regimes loyally in old Yugoslavia and made money by doing the dirty work are the ones who committed the most murders after 1941.
If the expulsion of minorities is agreed upon, there are other questions which will have to be dealt with, but we will come to them later.

The Greater Serbian Ideology
The case of Serbia raises the question of the responsibility of intellectuals in a particularly drastic way. The spectacle of intellectuals succumbing to uncritical and, eventually, utterly unrestrained patriotism and even jingoism is by no means rare, in particular in our century, when Julien Benda rightly characterized as one of "intellectual organization of political hatreds" (Benda 1955:21). But Serbia's war on Croatia, Bosnia-Herzegovina, and now Kosova, is not just another unjust war. It is rather a systematic onslaught of a large and well-equipped army and police force, together with assorted militias, on the civilian population of these countries, which initially had hardly any armed forces to speak of. The aim of this onslaught was - in the case of Kosova is - to conquer all or most of their territories, "cleanse" them of their non-Serb inhabitants and of all traces of their history and culture, settle them by Serbs, and annex them to Serbia. In the course of this war, the Serbs have perpetrated war crimes and crimes against humanity, including genocide, that had not been seen in Europe since World War II.

Moreover, the nature of the Greater Serbian ideology is such that these crimes have not been committed by individuals and groups acting on their own, in contravention of the official policies. War crimes of the latter sort are committed in virtually any war; some have been perpetrated by the Croats, Muslims, and possibly Kosovars, too. The Serbs, unlike their foes, have committed their crimes systematically and on a mass scale, in the course of carrying out orders and implementing the grand national program. The explanation of this apparently baffling fact is simple. Almost all other types of expansionist nationalism and pan-movements are after other peoples' lands, abut are willing to annex them together with their inhabitants. The fate of native inhabitants is never enviable, but it is neither extermination nor expulsion. The Greater Serbian nationalism, on the other hand, calls for the setting up of a greatly expanded and at the same time, "ethnically homogeneous" nation state. This is to be accomplished in an ethnically extremely mixed part of the world. The sole way of accomplishing this is by conquerings other peoples' lands and "ethnically cleansing" them by genocide and mass expulsion, the way the Serbs have been acting since 1991. That is why the Greater Serbian nationalism, if unchecked, ends up in "ethnic cleansing," and in the twentieth-century European context can be compared only to that of the Nazis.

Interestingly enough, some of the prominent Greater Serbian thinkers have been quite straightforward about this. The import of their ideology is spelled out in the titles of some of its basic texts: "Until Extermination, Yours [i.e. the Croats'] or Ours" by Nikola Stojanovic, "The Expulsion of Albanians" by Vasa Cubrilovic, "Homogeneous Serbia" by Stevan Moljevic (Grmek 1993). These titles announce the ideas advanced in the texts quite accurately. As early as 1902, Nikola Stojanovic depicted Croats as neither a people nor a tribe in their own right, but a mere shapeless mass that lacks a culture or language of its own and has always been ruled by others. Their hisotry is now entering its final stage, a fateful conflict with the superior, freedom-loving and state-building Serbs. "This battle must be fought `until extermination, ours or yours.' One side must succumb. The Croats will be the losing side; that is guaranteed by the fact that they are less numerous [than the Serbs], by their geographic position, by the fact that everywhere they live mixed with Serbs, and by the process of general evolution, in which the Serbs embody the idea of progress" (Stojanovic in Grmek 1993:61).

In 1973m Vasa Cubrilovic called for ridding Kosova of its Albanian population in order to settle it by Serbs. He praised the successful "cleansing" of Serbia proper of all "foreign elements," carried out by earlier governments (Cubrilovic in Grmek 1993:111), but pointed out the limited results of Serbian colonization of Kosova and argued that "the only way ... is the use of brutal force by organized state authorities" (Cubrilovic in Grmek 1993:113). He went on to present an elaborate blueprint for expulsion by systematic state terrorism supplemented by legal and economic pressure. There was no need to worry about public opinion abroad: "if Germany can expel tens of thousands of Jews, while Russia transfers millions from one end of the continent to another, the expulsion of a few hundred thousand Albanians will not cause a world war" (Cubrilovic in Grmek 1993:114).

Writing in June 1941 in German-occupied Belgrade, Stevan Moljevic argued that "the Serbs' first and fundamental duty" was the setting up of a Serbian state "uniting all Serbs and all lands where Serbs live" (Mojevic in Grmek 1993:128 & 131). This Greater and ethnically "homogeneous" Serbia was to include all lands where any Serbs lived, together with whatever additional territories they might want for economic, strategic, or other reasons. That added up to almost 70% what had been Yugoslavia, a third of Albania, and large chunks of Bulgaria, Romania, and Hungary. This was mandated by the Serbs' "historic mission," which was hegemony in Yugoslavia and throughout the Balkans (Mojevic in Grmek 1993:130).

But even the """"""""""""""""""""""""men of the GOD"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""' have the stomach to justify the atrocities.

Artemije - Advocate of Serbia´s Genocidal Policy in Kosova
July (Kosovapress)
The Serbian Bishop Artemije Radosavlevic gave an interview to the German daily "Berliner Zeitung" , in which he once again defended the fascist policies of Milosevic against Albanians in Kosova, taking as a pretext, the tragic murder of 14 Serb farmers.
Belgrade´s and the Bishop´s position on security in Kosova do not vary too much, both arguing in a curiously uniform way, that KFOR´s mission in Kosova has been unsuccessful and that only the return of Serb troops who "successfully kept peace" in Kosova would protect Serbs in Kosova. The call for the substitution of KFOR troops for Serb paramilitaries and police, those same forces who committed mass murder, reveals a completely unapologetic point of view, one which must confuse KFOR and UNMIK personnel who are so eager in propping up the Bishop as a partner for peace.
It is hard to stomach the crocidile tears that fall from the eyes of Belgrade´s leadership and the Church´s position is equally cynical. It is no surprise that these 14 dead took place on the heels of a declaration of the Serbian Church signed by the Bishop stating the Church would not participate in the Council for Intercommunal Relations established by the UN, a council that brings all community leaders to the same table. The world community has been dupped so many times before by the games Belgrade and the Church plays, it may be wise to look more closely at what is being done with this Gracka incident.
Most glaringly, it should not be a surprise to anyone that the rhetoric used today mirrors that which Milosevic and Serb nationalists used in 1980 and again in 1985 to justify denying Albanian their human rights. The reference the Bishop makes to "Serbs getting killed, raped and kidnapped by Albanians," fits in perfectly Belgrade´s line today and what Artemije himself used to stir up nationalism 19 years ago. The man who the West depends to sustain an atmosphere of civility and interethnic harmony is not ashamed to tell the German Daily that he justifies Serb atrocities as conditions of war. According to this man of faith, the mass murder of Albanians was justified during war and that it was time to forget it. According to him, the murders in Gracka is a greater crime than the murder of tens of thousands of Albanians. In the course of his interview, this man of the church representing the Serbian faithful has recycled Milosevic and Sesel cries for Albanian blood, once again citing Serbs are victims of "Genocide" and that Kosova is being ethnically cleansed of Serbs under the eyes of NATO.
Failure to note the decades of murder, torture, deportation of other human beings simply because they were of another ethnic group does not fit well in the rhetoric of a Kosova envisioned by the world community.
This "moderate" spokesperson for the Serb people in Kosova utters the now hollow cry that it is the Serbs who are victims of a plot to exterminate them, conveniently forgetting the works of Garasanin, Cubrilovic, Andric and clergy from the church, all readably available in Belgrade book shops. The German publisher Rullman said that the first European holocaust happened in Kosova, when Serbia was granted in 1912 sovereignty over a Kosova populated by 80% of the population which was not Serb. Serbs like those in the Church have done well to forget it. Today, Kosova is filled with mass graves, graves that emit the stench of war crimes and planned extermination. Albanians in their tens of thousands are searching for loved ones, seeking to just know for sure the fate of their kin. This man of God, Artemije, has nothing to say to these people. He uses the words of a murderous regime in Belgrade instead of extending the hand of sorrow, comfort, and solidarity. His hatred for other people runs so deep that he even cannot acknowledge the pain of his fellow Christians, who are also of the Eastern Church. Their sin is that they are simply not Serbs.
Albanians of all faiths lost so much to men of this elk, it is time for the world to read the words of such people, staring right at them in widely read newspapers, to stop dreaming and understand those with whom they are dealing. Artemije is not a man of peace, but a man of hatred, one which can go so far as to brush off mass murder and manipulate the deaths of 14 men to reinstate a murderous regime of oppression, brutality and criminality
or in german
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Gee, let me know when u're done with uncontrolled copy-pasting, so people can get back to discussion.

nationalism when is excessive is very dangerous. History have prooved that especially the serbs have passed any acceptable limit in nationalism. The raising of Serbia came through the doctrine of Cubrilovic(in theory) and hand of Rankovic ( in practice). Therefore you have had benefits from nationalisms and you have had the chance to express it in the most radical way. But that was valid untill the political circumstances and alliances are suitable(for example after Russo-Turkish war, or during the Cold War).
Now your nationalism doesnt work anymore. It only serves to hide the ORGANIZED attrocoties done from brainwashed military peoples.
You came like ""guests"" in this land:






You(serbs) must act like guests should act. The time of avars , Justinian &co is gone.
This is our land,it has been before 6-th century when serbs came in Balcan for the first time, it has been before 10 century AD time when serbs became christians, it has been before 12 century AD when the first ""serb"" orthodox church was established in the land of Illyria(Kosova).
This has been our land when the time starts.
There is no political-historical argument for you to claim our land as yours. If you took it because Russia was powerful in the past now its the time to return it to legitime peoples. The decline of albanians has finished. Now its the raise. In the future we will be capable to face you even in military conflict.

The diabolic fallacy of serbs propaganda MUST not put equality betwen all Balcan nations origin. The only 'authocton' language in Balcan is albanian language (and greek). It is spoken uninterrupted for at least 10000 years.

Quote:Serbia had the Kosovo battle in 1389 ....

Hmmm really?

Serbia DID NOT HAVE the Kosova battle. The coalition army HAD the battle of Kosova. The number of the Serbs soldiers participated in this coalition was lower than the number of albanians under Gjergjit II Balsha . Beside albanians, were hungarians, bosnians,etc.

On the other hand included in Turkish army were the serbian troops of Marko Kraljeviqi and Konstantin Dejanoviqi . The number is estimated to be 12000-14000.

IT HAS BEEN MORE SERBS IN TURKISH ARMY THAN IN COALITION ARMY.
LAZAR POSITION AS LEADER OF COALITION ARMY WAS JUST SYMBOLIC BECAUSE HE CONTIBUTED WITH THE LEAST NUMBER OF SOLDIERS

Let me know if you guys want more history, I will provide more maps too.... :lol:

Ventimille Wrote:Gee, let me know when u're done with uncontrolled copy-pasting, so people can get back to discussion.

I am putting a part of history that has been written by historians, since my word is not valid....