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Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - aranar63 - 08-13-2008
NATO killed a lot of civilians in Serbia...., US&Co are killing civilians in Irak na Afganistan.. and all that are called as peacekipping operation.
I see..
Western civilisatino is a supr-nation and so US & Co. ca decide who can live and who must die. And Russia can't protect her civilians because US & Co do not approve that... You know, there was such person Gitler, he did the same thing as US & Co are doing now.
and there is not a god damm thig russia can do about it, you fell helpless? there was another person who did that remember prague spring? or are you too young to remember it?, ther is another one who try to take west Berlin remember that, and another one who let the afghanistan campaing maybe you fought there,
but thrue history your country has not being pretty clearm did we forget that part of your history was re written by Stalin, how low can people go, we are watching you parruskies, at the end this will have repercussions in the way Europe and the US do bussiness with Russia, member is a capitalist world,Offer and demand, and we control the demand of your most preciuos commodities.
Why should i believe what your parrusky TV is showing you and not all the news organizations around the world? Hey Chernobyl never happend right? i was in Europe at the time it took you guys 3 days to tell the truth and onlyafter radiations level where xtremli high in Norway, member? parrusky friend? or where you too young? and yes Adolf did it Thats why i call Putin=Hitler, as in Adolf and Meded=eil=Goehring as in Herman, i just need to find the new russian goebbles
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Caucasus - 08-13-2008
solo Wrote:Caucasus Wrote:http://georgia-lies.narod.ru
I cannot undrstand why the "old" democracies behave like they do?
Georgia started the war against Ossetia breaking the treatys, it broke its own word,
Georgian troops attacked and killed "blue helmets" (peacemakers) that were there according
to INTERNATIONAL treaty, Georgia destroys the Ossetian cities and villages,
Georgian troops kill Ossetian peaceful people with knife cutting their throats,
they override them by tanks, they set them on fire alive in the houses,
they kidnapp young Ossetian women, and the Europe says it is all OK?
The video of burning houses that BBC and CNN are showing to you are not
the video of Georgian houses - that are OSSETIAN houses
thet were set on fire by GEORGIAN TROOPS!!!!!
Your news agencies lie to you!!!!
The truth about Georgian war is here:
http://georgia-lies.narod.ru
The world agencies do not tell the significant facts of the war in South Ossetia.
The site is in English and is made by independent people who want to let the world
know the TRUTH. It is up to us to stop the war that was started by Georgia. Please help to spread this address to as much peopl
By the way, Georgian blue helmets and civilians were killed several days before that war started. It is said it was not suicide, for sure.
It is funny, how (north) ossetians forgot, that they were occupied by russia not so long time ago and it is sad, that they do not remember how russians were killing their ancestors, how they humiliated them... If nation does not know it's own history, it is no nation.
You are mistaken or you are lying understanding what you are dong. The "blue helmets" of Georgian origin several times before the start of Georgian agression against South Ossetia did the following thing:
1. From time to time Georgian Army shooted and bombed positions where the "blue helmets" were standing. There were not only Georgian, but Russian, North Ossetian and South Ossetian blue helmets. At one and the same place.
2. Every time 40 minutes before the bombing of the blue Helmets' position started, the Georgian Blue Helmets had left those position in some direction and their mobile phones had been switched off at that time. They knew beforehand when the artillery shooting was to be started.
3. They did not tell about coming shooting any of their "brothers in arms" (I mean Blue Helmets of other countries) they wanted them just to let them die.
4. At the start of Georgian agression against South Ossetia the Georgian Blue Helmets were the first who attacked other Blue Helmets. They tried to do it in order to get some extra time before Russia would know about the agression. Nobody of Blue Helmets expected Georgians to be such traitors (I mean the idea of Blue Helmets).
And for the present time the positions of Russian and Ossetian army are still under the fire of snipers and artillery. When Russian Army detects where from the fire is they destroy the attacking unit. I think it is right.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - tamuna - 08-13-2008
lvm Wrote:tamuna Wrote:Gift Wrote:Internet here is cheap and fast enough to allow watching videos and free surfing the web, we don't pay for minutes, just for you to know))))))))
...
Has anybody seen "peacekeeping" forces invading country and bombing the whole territory?????Have u seen such????Me no! This is not normal and Russians' rhetoric is NONSENSE!!!!This is not the first time they invaded Georgia. The history of Georgia is full of their aggression and betrayal.The world is not well informed. Russia does not care Ossetians a hoot, either ABkhazians, and this is apparent
You are barefaced liar. Russian peacekeeping forces did not invade Georgia. But Russian army invaded to safe Russian peaceforces and civilians because they were being ruthless killed by Georgia army.
At first I am not liar!!!!!!if u want to see the liars listen Russian officials!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Do u know what Russia has done to Georgia in 1801 and 1921?if no, read the history, and u ll see who is the agressor and who is not.
georgia has n=no other way, if not so, Ossetia and with them Georgian villages will be attacked by russians and ok, they are protecting "peacekeepers" what are they doing in the whole country?why are they bombing cities, hospitals, killing foreign journalists, and at last now looting Gori???
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - lvm - 08-13-2008
aranar63 Wrote:NATO killed a lot of civilians in Serbia...., US&Co are killing civilians in Irak na Afganistan.. and all that are called as peacekipping operation.
I see..
Western civilisatino is a supr-nation and so US & Co. ca decide who can live and who must die. And Russia can't protect her civilians because US & Co do not approve that... You know, there was such person Gitler, he did the same thing as US & Co are doing now.
and there is not a god damm thig russia can do about it, you fell helpless? there was another person who did that remember prague spring? or are you too young to remember it?, ther is another one who try to take west Berlin remember that, and another one who let the afghanistan campaing maybe you fought there,
but thrue history your country has not being pretty clearm did we forget that part of your history was re written by Stalin, how low can people go, we are watching you parruskies, at the end this will have repercussions in the way Europe and the US do bussiness with Russia, member is a capitalist world,Offer and demand, and we control the demand of your most preciuos commodities.
Why should i believe what your parrusky TV is showing you and not all the news organizations around the world? Hey Chernobyl never happend right? i was in Europe at the time it took you guys 3 days to tell the truth and onlyafter radiations level where xtremli high in Norway, member? parrusky friend? or where you too young? and yes Adolf did it Thats why i call Putin=Hitler, as in Adolf and Meded=eil=Goehring as in Herman, i just need to find the new russian goebbles
All what youre saying is about SU not Russia. Do you fell difference? It was in past. SU inavsion in Afg. was more than 30 years ago but US & Nato are doing all that now. BTW, Stalin was born in Georgia and it was genocide against russian too. BTW I am not Rus and even not live in Russia but do not like when dark is called as light anf vice versa. As for putin.... I am sure US president did much more evil.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - aranar63 - 08-13-2008
Tamuna, if they are looting Gori it just show how well the parruski army personel is pay, way to go parruskies showing your true colors now he, It is so Sad, but hey if looting make them better that anybody else (the angels army, defender of the weak)then so be it, but this is not a profesional army,but a bunch of comon criminals, but i don't blame them either hey if you get pay pennies for what you do this is the results.
professional armies are well paid, no need for looting. Oh i guess in Russian TV is being reported, that the russian army is helping residents of Gori move by taking their belongings right qwest and all of you tovarich in crime friends, you guys should applied for a US work visa and come to work as DJ, you are the masters, hey startin pay is 100k
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Caucasus - 08-13-2008
Ant think over this fact:
16 (SIXTEEN) hours the Georgian army was bombing Tskhinval. There were only civilians , about 1000 of South Ossetian Army men, and about 500 of peace-keepers. By the end of the first bombing period 1500 civilians were dead!!!! WHERE , I ask, WHERE WERE YOUR THE SO CALLED FREE MASS MEDIA?????
WHY THEY KEPT SILENCE???? WHY THEY STARTED SCREEMING ONLY WHEN RUSSIAN TROOPS ENTERED SOUTH OSSETIA???
AND ONE MORE QUESTION - WHY some articles of western mass media in internet which are more or less truly dissapear in 3-4 hour after they appear? Who tells to delete them? May be its because they do not coinside with the PREPLANNED press campaign? So I know now that there is no freedom in the west, it is a fairy-tale. The western mass media are controlled by CIA. Directly or Inderectly. I have a great respect to those journalists who try if not to tell the truth, then at least rise 'incovenient' questions to which neither Georgia, nor USA cannot give any answer.
Here in Russia (which is not free by your opinion) we can watch CNN, BBC, visit any web-site at our will. The citizens of "FREE" Georgia can not visit any site with ".ru" domain or watch Russian channels as they did several days ago. I think it is a great examle of FREEDOM of their president to lie and to take FREEDOM from his nation only by his will.
http://www.georgia-lies.narod.ru
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Gift - 08-13-2008
tamuna Wrote:At first I am not liar!!!!!!if u want to see the liars listen Russian officials!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Do u know what Russia has done to Georgia in 1801 and 1921?if no, read the history, and u ll see who is the agressor and who is not.Please give me a single evidence of Russians bombing cities and hospitals. And looting Gori. Not in written form but video evidence. I suppose it's anti-russian propaganda, that's all.
georgia has n=no other way, if not so, Ossetia and with them Georgian villages will be attacked by russians and ok, they are protecting "peacekeepers" what are they doing in the whole country?why are they bombing cities, hospitals, killing foreign journalists, and at last now looting Gori???
You shouldn't drag nowadays events to year 1801 - let's blame then France for Napoleon and Germany for Hitler, and GB for India and Africa.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - aranar63 - 08-13-2008
All what youre saying is about SU not Russia. Do you fell difference? It was in past. SU inavsion in Afg. was more than 30 years ago but US & Nato are doing all that now. BTW, Stalin was born in Georgia and it was genocide against russian too. BTW I am not Rus and even not live in Russia but do not like when dark is called as light anf vice versa. As for putin.... I am sure US president did much more evil
Same shit different era, same mentality nothing has change, and yes they are times when our prez did things that we do not approved, but we have the guts to aknowledge not spinn it, like you guys do, and in some cases they where force to step down. For ex ask your ex allied Vietnam, if they want to be close to Russia or America see what they tell you, this is a country that we almost destroyed, ask them ,have you ever being there parrusky friend?......... thought so, so we have being investing in Vietnamm as they understand that, todays world is rule by COMMERCE not guns, and the biggest market is......... oh AMERICA not russia
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Gift - 08-13-2008
aranar63 Wrote:of course not gift you have a gift of spinning the truth you shoul be a DJ, the fact is that this war was started by russia, S Ossetia is still part of Georgia get it, and it was not started to stop genocide by the all good russian army (the angels), it is the attempt by meded=evil and putin to make the world see that they are not happy with Xpansion of NATO, of course you can't talk about Europe or America you just don't have any facts.Well, I could say that the war was started by Saakashvili according to McCain's orders to win the US elections on anti-Russian wave. Let us not be absurd.
Do you consider the fact that 1400 civilians and 12 peacekeepers were KILLED BEFORE our troops arrived in Ossetia? Answer this question.
It seems you guys think that Russia STARTED the war because you personally don't like Russia and Russian politics :banghead How could I make you see the facts, not your emotions about how Russian bear abuses poor little Georgia?
I'll repeat it.
Do you consider the fact that 1400 civilians and 12 peacekeepers were KILLED BEFORE our troops arrived in Ossetia? Answer this question.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Likno - 08-13-2008
Dear reader! Before you read our article, reject all interethnic prejudices and think of those innocent victims of nonsense of the governments, those women, old men and children who now perish under bombs and ruins! For the sake of these people, our general duty is an attempt to understand what is actually going on and to appeal instigators to responsibility for these awful crimes against humanity!
100 years under the oppression
The conflict of Georgia and South Ossetia has already been lasting for almost a century. For the first time South Ossetia has undergone aggression and genocide from Georgia in 1920. That time 18 thousand people perished, more than 50 thousand were expelled to the north of Ossetia. This aggression repeated on a regular basis. When Soviet Union had collapsed, under the international laws South Ossetia did not belong to Georgia any more and, it is quite clear, that on September, 20th 1990 it tried to get separated from it and become the sovereign republic. But Georgia refused to recognize South Ossetia as an independent territory.
As a result of the Georgian terror only for the period from January, 6th till September, 1st, 1991 209 people have been killed, 460 - wounded, 150 - missing. Since February, 1992 as a result of artillery bombardments and severe massacre of ossetins the quantity of Genocide victims was constantly growing. As a result on June, 24th, 1992 in Sochi Russia, Georgia and South Ossetia signed an agreement on principles of peace settlement of the georgian-ossetian conflict according to which on July, 14th, 1992 the forces consisting of Russian, Georgian and South ossetian peacemakers entered on the lawful bases of the given agreement and the world right in a zone of the conflict
Here it would seem that ossetian people were rescueed: peacemakers reliably protect borders from intrusions from the Georgian party, and the situation as a whole appeared in a view of projectors of the world community. But it is necessary to understand, that destiny of the small states frequently depend not on their own will, as it occured:
On the night of August, 2nd South Ossetia has been fired by Georgia therefore six people were lost. Georgia declared that fire had been opened in reply to bombardment of blockhouses of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Georgia. Authorities of the non-recognized republic declare that the Georgian militarians started to shoot first. On the night of August, 3rd bombardments have proceeded. Further on the August evening, 7th the unilateral decision of the president of Georgia stopped shooting and he offered to begin negotiations for de-escalation of a situation. It is interesting to know that the Georgians militarians finished operative expansion at this time. Some hours later Georgia declared about the beginning of operation on "restoration of constitutional order" and at 03:00 has perfidiously intruded in territory of South Ossetia. That night the Georgian peacemakers opened fire straight at Russian and South ossetian colleagues. The Georgian infantry with support of tanks and aircraft began to approach in all directions, and heavy artillery systems of Georgia destroyed the capital of non-recognized republic, the city of Tshinvali, where that awful night about 1000 peace inhabitants were lost.
For world mass-media operations in South Ossetia became really "hit" news only after the Russian tanks in reply to the Georgian aggression had entered the non-recognized republic, and the Russian planes had started to bomb military objects on the Georgian territory. It is interesting, isn't it? At that time Russia called an extraordinary session of the Secutiry Council of the United Nations on which no concrete decision was accepted that could settle the conflict.
On August, 11th in Tbilisi the president of Georgia Michael Saakashvili at presence of the Heads of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of France and Finland Bernard Kushner and Alexander Stubba signed the document on fire cease from the Georgian party, but, for some reason fights and bombardments proceeded further…
The waiter serves the dish!
Lately during this awful conflict many people were lost. And for the sake of what? Who it is necessary for that in bloody fights 3 brotherly people would be involved? Who is humanitarian catastrophe and death of thousands of innocent people necessary for? Let's try to understand who this war is really favourable for:
South Ossetia? The Small area, with small army knows that Georgia has recently increased the military budget, that the countries of Europe put a plenty of military technics to Georgia that more recently on the territory of Georgia joint military exercises of NATO were done. Is the military conflict necessary for it? It is unlikely.
The majority of the world mass-media accuse Russia of the current events that Russia prepared and started this bloody conflict. Is it really true? We should not forget about an aversion of the West for Russia, and, hence, about treatment of many events not in favour of the last one though it frequently can not be the truth. Despite the pro-American Georgian president, all this time Russia tried to be in a friendly way to Georgia, recollecting that 60 years ago these two peoples battled side by side against fascism. In addition more recently Russia began to get out of ruin of reorganization, and the similar bloody conflict now is not favorable for it. And Russia got in a very uneasy situation: on the one hand, it is necessary to help the citizens (90 % of the lost peace inhabitants in South Ossetia are owners of the Russian passports), on the other hand Russia can'to help them for they are on the territory of the other state. If you help, you will get international condemnation. If you do not help, you will get discontent of inhabitants of Caucasus, condemnation of "treachery" of the central authorities. Besides all this situation is a superfluous pressure on borders, and on the whole Caucasus, and it has always been a very restless place. Military actions in South Ossetia influence the Russian share market if war keeps going on for a long term, investment risks will increase, as a result the credit rating will fall, and demand for national currency will fall. The rouble exchange rate has already strongly fallen in relation to dollar. Considering deplorableness of the Russian economy, Russia hardly needs such consequences.
It is necessary to mention that Russia from the legal point of view operates absolutely soundly and legitimately. According to operating international agreements including the agreement of 1999, Russia is obliged to take under protection the other party in case of infringement of one of the parties of the agreement on cease-fire. That has occured.
It is unlikely that the war is necessary for Georgia: coffins in the Georgian families, volunteers from Caucasus, guerrilla war in case of success, and shame in case of failure. The economy of Georgia is near death, poverty. Can war really help to solve economic problems with such expenses and victims? No.
War is a deepening of intensity with Russia on which depends the lion's share of the Georgian well-being.
If one assumes, that war is necessary to a management of Georgia and Saakashvili personally, it is quite probable! From the military point of view, the initiator of the war is the management of Georgia and became absolutely clear, we shall remind one more time: right at the moment when Saakashvili finished his speech on the TV, the Georgian parts should be finishing operative deployment, because in two – three hours operation had already begun! Besides the present Georgian government abounds in similar military – barbarous actions against South Ossetia and Abkhazia in the past. In the course of operations soldiers of the Russian army managed to take the plan of the Georgian army approaching (it was repeatedly shown on TV) in which all had been planned accurate within an hour. As also the date of Olympic Gamesopening was chosen for attacking Ossetia not casually: taking into account the fact, that Russia had to make a response this very day, it can impair spoil the attitude in the world to the Olympic Games in Sochi. In addition to the general picture one can remind, that the beginning of operations was accompanied by DDoS – attacks to information sites of South Ossetia.
Precisely planned information war towards Russia was being held from the very beginning by Georgia and the West. While dozens of peaceful Ossetins were speaking about barbarities of Georgian soldiers, the Georgian president declared all world an attack of Russia on its small and innocent democratic country and asked for help! While the Georgian systems of volley fire "Hailstones" ruined the whole city, having buried under these terrible ruins thousands of people, the western mass – media showed, how the Russian planes are striking the Georgian military objects … Certainly they are striking! And how one can protect South Ossetia from the Georgian aggression? How one can trust the mandate of Saakashvili about cease – fire in the very night before destruction of capital of a non – recognized republic?
The protector of the peoples.
Meanwhile, you see, that the attack of Georgia on South Ossetia and massacre of the Russian citizens, violating of all the conventions achieved by hard work, committing of war crimes, genocide and creating of humanitarian catastrophe is a suicide for Georgia!
Some analysts consider, that Saakashvili decided to unleash the war for the purpose of the long – term joining NATO, and, certainly, relied on the considerable contribution and support of the USA in this conflict.
For objectivity and honesty we consider it necessary to describe to you the interest of Washington in the conflict:
- making tensity on Russian frontiers and discrediting of the country;
- pulling Russia into coflict, which used to happen in our coutry many times and pulling the country into cold war with all above enumerated disadvantages;
- raising the USA authority in international society and Georgian people opinion ( Georgia will "lose position" without Washington);
- "untying" Georgia from Russia and attaching her to Europe, joining to NATO and locating in Georgia military bases and systems;
- each war leads to purchase of weapon not only by sides being at war, but also by neighboring territiries, and demand of equipment. The main supplier of weapons in the world is the USA;
- the Americans have a new trump in polemics with the Kremlin, Saakashvili is an obvious marionette and he will finish off agression ( or will begin it ) when Washington just give a sign.
Aggression against Ossetia is a reconnaissance of Russia opportunities and derivation of attention of world community from any important event. Some people believe, that it will be blitzkrieg of the USA against Iran, or against Venezuela, and even against Russia. Also it’s important to know, that there is a crisis in the USA and America needs a new war, but not the second Iraq and Afghanistan. Some people consider, that America wants to involve Russia in full - scale war in Caucasus, scarifying the true vassal Georgia, and then they draw Ukraine in NATO. There is also an opinion, that all it occurs, because of the catastrophic reduction of natural resources of fresh water and oil in the Earth, so all this petty intrigues with Ukraine, Iran, Afghanistan and Iraq – parts of one circuit.
If we reflect all together...
At what result did we arrive? Authorities of the states started repartition of the influence in the world once again, the regular echo of cold war, which seemed to be completed. What Georgia today does by means of volley installations "Hailstones" and tanks, reminds events in Serbia and Kosovo, Croatia and Bosnia which got from the international community an estimation - "genocide". “Southern Ossetins are about 100 thousand, maybe, little bit more. Two thousand victims and 30 thousand refugees, isn’t it enough?! How many people should be killed, so that it could be qualified as genocide?! » - declared the Representative of the Russian Federation at the United Nations, Vitaly Tchurkin.
Is it possible, that our governments so easily sacrifice tens thousands of human lives only for the right to possess an oil pipeline? Is it possible, that lie in 21-st century – is a unique way of governing, and those, who tells more lies and does more loudly, are right? Each person is in power to change both his/ her own destiny, and the destiny of the world! People should understand, that while our governments try to bite each other in race for a profit, we are not in safety. We are sick and tired of being deceived! We want to appeal to you to rise and declare: “The people are dying there!” Tomorrow we can turn to be in their position! We call upon for reflecting on it. Everybody can face the war, and it’s our duty to safeguard ourselves and close people against this tragedy.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - aranar63 - 08-13-2008
WHY some articles of western mass media in internet which are more or less truly dissapear in 3-4 hour after they appear? Who tells to delete them? May be its because they do not
Here is your answer, they don't dissapear my parrusky friend, they are just moved to make room for newer updated news, we live in a xtremly fast moving world, you may not understand it yet but eventually you will. So the news are moved inside the webside, they are there, you just have to find them.
Should we ask Alexander Bortnikov the new Joseph Goebbles of your country,all the manipulation that is going on right now, it is obvious we are not seeing the same on German,British, American, France etc etc TV as in parrusky TV, hey the whole wetern media is manipulate it by the CIA ha :haha , oh men oh men parrusky friends you really are in deperatly need of change, but hey i personally do not give a S, if you get it or not, if you feel you are free with the garbage you new Goebbles are telling you then be happy
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Khelkafuin - 08-13-2008
Gift Wrote:aranar63 Wrote:of course not gift you have a gift of spinning the truth you shoul be a DJ, the fact is that this war was started by russia, S Ossetia is still part of Georgia get it, and it was not started to stop genocide by the all good russian army (the angels), it is the attempt by meded=evil and putin to make the world see that they are not happy with Xpansion of NATO, of course you can't talk about Europe or America you just don't have any facts.Well, I could say that the war was started by Saakashvili according to McCain's orders to win the US elections on anti-Russian wave. Let us not be absurd.
Do you consider the fact that 1400 civilians and 12 peacekeepers were KILLED BEFORE our troops arrived in Ossetia? Answer this question.
It seems you guys think that Russia STARTED the war because you personally don't like Russia and Russian politics :banghead How could I make you see the facts, not your emotions about how Russian bear abuses poor little Georgia?
I'll repeat it.
Do you consider the fact that 1400 civilians and 12 peacekeepers were KILLED BEFORE our troops arrived in Ossetia? Answer this question.
It seems to me that our stubborn friend cannot understand this fact.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - lvm - 08-13-2008
Some day US & Co. choked with their lie.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - tamuna - 08-13-2008
Gift Wrote:tamuna Wrote:At first I am not liar!!!!!!if u want to see the liars listen Russian officials!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Do u know what Russia has done to Georgia in 1801 and 1921?if no, read the history, and u ll see who is the agressor and who is not.Please give me a single evidence of Russians bombing cities and hospitals. And looting Gori. Not in written form but video evidence. I suppose it's anti-russian propaganda, that's all.
georgia has n=no other way, if not so, Ossetia and with them Georgian villages will be attacked by russians and ok, they are protecting "peacekeepers" what are they doing in the whole country?why are they bombing cities, hospitals, killing foreign journalists, and at last now looting Gori???
You shouldn't drag nowadays events to year 1801 - let's blame then France for Napoleon and Germany for Hitler, and GB for India and Africa.
Come to Gori now and see !It is the evidence!!!! kazaks, north ossetians and russian army units are looting the city, and our present is always the part of future, I mean by this that Georgia has good experience from Russia, and it no longer wants to tolerate it dictat, that is over!!!can u answer one question if Georgia is all wet, wrong, aggresor, invader and violater of a an agreement why is it that the almost whole world is on their side and why is Russia ousted from G8?
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - tamuna - 08-13-2008
tamuna Wrote:Gift Wrote:tamuna Wrote:At first I am not liar!!!!!!if u want to see the liars listen Russian officials!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Do u know what Russia has done to Georgia in 1801 and 1921?if no, read the history, and u ll see who is the agressor and who is not.Please give me a single evidence of Russians bombing cities and hospitals. And looting Gori. Not in written form but video evidence. I suppose it's anti-russian propaganda, that's all.
georgia has n=no other way, if not so, Ossetia and with them Georgian villages will be attacked by russians and ok, they are protecting "peacekeepers" what are they doing in the whole country?why are they bombing cities, hospitals, killing foreign journalists, and at last now looting Gori???
You shouldn't drag nowadays events to year 1801 - let's blame then France for Napoleon and Germany for Hitler, and GB for India and Africa.
Come to Gori now and see !It is the evidence!!!! kazaks, north ossetians and russian army units are looting the city, and our present is always the part of future, I mean by this that Georgia has good experience from Russia, and it no longer wants to tolerate it dictat, that is over!!!can u answer one question if Georgia is all wet, wrong, aggresor, invader and violater of a an agreement why is it that the almost whole world is on their side and why is Russia ousted from G8?
and how can i give u evidence when several minutes earlier russians and kazaks ousted georgian and international journalists and red Cross as well?how can we take evidence under bomb shells?
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - aranar63 - 08-13-2008
The majority of the world mass-media accuse Russia of the current events that Russia prepared and started this bloody conflict. Is it really true? We should not forget about an aversion of the West for Russia, and, hence, about treatment of many events not in favour of the last one though it frequently can not be the truth. Despite the pro-American Georgian president, all this time Russia tried to be in a friendly way to Georgia, recollecting that 60 years ago these two peoples battled side by side against fascism. In addition more recently Russia began to get out of ruin of reorganization, and the similar bloody conflict now is not favorable for it. And Russia got in a very uneasy situation: on the one hand, it is necessary to help the citizens (90 % of the lost peace inhabitants in South Ossetia are owners of the Russian passports), on the other hand Russia can'to help them for they are on the territory of the other state. If you help, you will get international condemnation. If you do not help, you will get discontent of inhabitants of Caucasus, condemnation of "treachery" of the central authorities. Besides all this situation is a superfluous pressure on borders, and on the whole Caucasus, and it has always been a very restless place. Military actions in South Ossetia influence the Russian share market if war keeps going on for a long term, investment risks will increase, as a result the credit rating will fall, and demand for national currency will fall. The rouble exchange rate has already strongly fallen in relation to dollar. Considering deplorableness of the Russian economy, Russia hardly needs such consequences.
Finaly a Parussky that we can talk too, I do see your point of view my friend, we do not wish to go star another war, not because we can't, because we do not have the need to. We do will bring Ukraine in to NATO do not dobt it, and now faster, because of the russian attitud towards in Georgia.
We do not want another war, could this have being instigated by us, yes it could, very easealy, you are the first parrusky to aknowdledege that S Ossetia is not an independent state and that russia cross a international recognize border, may be you agree to that this is call agression, maybe they where treaties, and it was planed, the truth is that this is a just the re arrengment of the world map, for the second time, my parrusky friend, we know that we need to place this anti-missiles system deep in eastern Europe, we know that we need Ukraine in NATO, and your leaders know our intentions, then why make it more eassily for us to do that?
We agree a new arm race will be catastrophic for russia in economic stand point, Russia needs a lot of help, oil and gas money is good, but is not enough, yesterday i was trying to make this exact point, we are always going to go for what we want it is in our nature, my point is they should have being from russia more talks before the invasion, russia should have make their point on western TV loud and clear, as to what was happening in S Ossetia, it did not, all we saw here was the invasion of a big country to an smaller one, in a sovereign territory, S Ossetia as you wrote is neither part os russia or an independent international recognize state, and people can spin whatever they want, this is what we saw.
As you point out Russia needs the west more then the west needs russia, i will give you leaders a little advise, keep your heads cool, do not think for a moment that if,we are challenged anywhere in the world we won't take action, think of the consecuenses of your action for your people, you guys can have another arm race, but if we Anericans feel treaten by russia and by saying Americans i do not mean the goverment but the people, we will act, and the first will be a dratically increase in defense spending wich allready is 1 trillion dollars a year, keep it in perspective it is what russia produce in 8 months, what we do it in 28 days, it is the perception of the american people that count,if we do not feel a treat by russia, then there will be no necessity for such race to start, your leaders should know this.
As i tell you my parrusky friend, this war need to be stop the longer it takes the more innocent people will die, the more we will think about the treat of russia, you see you goverment is talking about putting a bomber base in Cuba, there will be deep consecuenses if this come to bear for russia, mark my word.
It is extremely importat to understand, first we do not want another war where our sons and daughters are involve, this one muss stop.
And my Parrusky friend it was very enlightment to me to read your post. have nice evening
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - tamuna - 08-13-2008
Khelkafuin Wrote:Gift Wrote:aranar63 Wrote:of course not gift you have a gift of spinning the truth you shoul be a DJ, the fact is that this war was started by russia, S Ossetia is still part of Georgia get it, and it was not started to stop genocide by the all good russian army (the angels), it is the attempt by meded=evil and putin to make the world see that they are not happy with Xpansion of NATO, of course you can't talk about Europe or America you just don't have any facts.Well, I could say that the war was started by Saakashvili according to McCain's orders to win the US elections on anti-Russian wave. Let us not be absurd.
Do you consider the fact that 1400 civilians and 12 peacekeepers were KILLED BEFORE our troops arrived in Ossetia? Answer this question.
It seems you guys think that Russia STARTED the war because you personally don't like Russia and Russian politics :banghead How could I make you see the facts, not your emotions about how Russian bear abuses poor little Georgia?
I'll repeat it.
Do you consider the fact that 1400 civilians and 12 peacekeepers were KILLED BEFORE our troops arrived in Ossetia? Answer this question.
It seems to me that our stubborn friend cannot understand this fact.
I am not a bigot and i always try to find truth and it does not mean that me or others are biased . nobody knows what happened in reality and whose was the first fire, if u have such evidence i m willing to see it. but until that answer me why are there only russian "peacekeepers" as u know, everywher peacekeepers are mixed from different countries, and in Ossetia there should have been from the whole CIS and the reason they r not is that Russia dominated in CIS when it was created andthe document about cease-fire in 1994 also says that there should be peacekeepers from CIS!! why are nt they?
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - tamuna - 08-13-2008
It seems to me that our stubborn friend cannot understand this fact.[/quote]
I am not a bigot and i always try to find truth and it does not mean that me or others are biased . nobody knows what happened in reality and whose was the first fire, if u have such evidence i m willing to see it. but until that answer me why are there only russian "peacekeepers" as u know, everywher peacekeepers are mixed from different countries, and in Ossetia there should have been from the whole CIS and the reason they r not is that Russia dominated in CIS when it was created andthe document about cease-fire in 1994 also says that there should be peacekeepers from CIS!! why are nt they?[/quote]
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - aranar63 - 08-13-2008
Some day US & Co. choked with their lie.
hey my Parrusky friend, we are still waiting on your past premier Krutchew to come back from the death and bury us, how much longer are we gona wait?
maybe putin can help him, he will be ill advise, but you parrusky people like to be at war, you guys enjoy it too much, that's why they re-instituted the military parade in red square, this year, you do like to see your old military out dated hardware, we don't like military parade is just a waste of money, and don't need to show anybody what we have, we just know it.
Some day maybe russia will behave like a civilize country.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - qwerty - 08-13-2008
aranar63 Wrote:I don't speak of how mighty Russia or US or European countries are and I don't make any historical forecasts. I speak of genocidal Georgian deeds here and now - have you seen crying Ossetian civilians? Try and find the video-chronicles, without comments from any side, if you think that every official news lie.
of course not gift you have a gift of spinning the truth you shoul be a DJ, the fact is that this war was started by russia, S Ossetia is still part of Georgia get it, and it was not started to stop genocide by the all good russian army (the angels), it is the attempt by meded=evil and putin to make the world see that they are not happy with Xpansion of NATO, of course you can't talk about Europe or America you just don't have any facts, and making forecast, you can either,this is Geo-politics at his best, your kremlin master just feed the proletariat what they want them to see, i mind you that most of your people live under xtreme poverty and don't have acces to decent information, and by decent i mean unbias. This is a fact
as is say the reason behind all of this is NATO xpansion, and lost of politicals influence areas around the russian empire, i talk about the economy of your and my country yesterday, because this has a deep impact,
conditions in russia are improving but it is not a 1 world country, not even close, and you guys can't debate or make forecast because you are afraid of the future, we are not. with all the problems that we have we are not, we know where we are and kmow where we want to go, we know how well bringing Ukraine in to NATO will serve us and know how well anti-missile system deep in easter europe will serve us, and we will do it.
Parrukies get it you can not keep up with us at any level.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - qwerty - 08-13-2008
aranar63 Wrote:And we watch and read not only Russian channels, mark you.
I really doubt, that having friends in Moskow and over the former SU, and i have being in Moskow a couple of times, but it does not matter, get it russia don't want another arm race with us, it just can afford it, we will push the NATO expansion it serve us extremly well, and there is not a thing that you and all the parruskies in the world can do about it, but kill inocent civilians, by the way did you got to see the ITN report in S Ossettia or was it too long and your internet minutes are running out?, face the truth, you guys can stop us, not now or in 100 years, in this world you either lead or are left behind in the dust of history,it happend to your country once, and it will happen again, having a little bit of dough is good, trying to make yourself something bigger then you are because of that is sad, should use your new find revival for the good of your people, trying to intimidate the wold, maybe europe not us, as we know how strong our country is, stay tuned there is more to come :haha
Hello, my ignorant quazi-American friend who knows everything about consumption and is ready to consume all around. From your yesterday posts here on this forum I read you as follows. You are 45 years old, holding some middle position (not a sycophant in an office or grease-monkey). You work for a small business - I may dare a guess that it is recycling or something like that (probably you own one). In short, you truly sound like gathering shit from streets and doing something innovative out of it - because this is exactly how you write. I mean, the manner. And you are not American by birth (not "born free" as you proudly urged). Your native language is unmistakably Spanish, you make an unbelievably huge amount of mistakes and misspellings - more than any Russian schoolboy who have been learning English for 5 years or so. You've been living in the US for around 20 years altogether, which makes me wonder if you are normal - not being able to learn the language during all this time.
Your head is full of detached ideas and images from American culture and political ideology. These, being totally disconnected, make a perfect mess which comes out in the form of continuous talk about consumption, American money and weapons. You seem to wear this ideas as others would wear a coat. Only that you cannot take it off - there's nothing inside, man. Everybody here already understood from what you've said: America is rich and powerful. I mean, it is a simple idea which does not need many words to be conveyed. Do you have anything more to say?
And, well, if the US is so strong, why didn't it do something with Russia? This is a simple question, baby. No "would" or "could" - Why they didn't? Why Dick and Bush behave like teenagers with their pants soiled? Do something - make them bad Russians pay! And don't tell me "they will" - 'cause they won't.
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Caucasus - 08-13-2008
aranar63 Wrote:WHY some articles of western mass media in internet which are more or less truly dissapear in 3-4 hour after they appear? Who tells to delete them? May be its because they do not
Here is your answer, they don't dissapear my parrusky friend, they are just moved to make room for newer updated news, we live in a xtremly fast moving world, you may not understand it yet but eventually you will. So the news are moved inside the webside, they are there, you just have to find them.
Should we ask Alexander Bortnikov the new Joseph Goebbles of your country,all the manipulation that is going on right now, it is obvious we are not seeing the same on German,British, American, France etc etc TV as in parrusky TV, hey the whole wetern media is manipulate it by the CIA ha :haha , oh men oh men parrusky friends you really are in deperatly need of change, but hey i personally do not give a S, if you get it or not, if you feel you are free with the garbage you new Goebbles are telling you then be happy
So , Did you mean that your mass media have servers with so little diskspace that it is usufficient for saving some text data for a period more than 3-4 hours? It seems to me you are strongly mistaken... The news from hedlines are usually shifted to news archives... And you can acess the news article by a constant link which is unic for every article... Excuse me for the explanation of such an ordinary thing well known to any educated person... The fact is that YOUR mass media are CENSORED... As for Russia - Look , I was listening today to a radio programme on Radio Echo of Moscow where there was a discussion about the coming Tribunal , and the Topic was: Who must be in front of Tribunal? Only Georgia or Georgia+Russia+Ossetias? Can yuo imagine such a conversation in FREE Georgia where Internet (part of it) and Russian Channels are banned? The population of Georgia even did not know that they attacked Ossetia first... They get information from the only source , that has the Only One opinion.. And they have no choice.. If this is a Democracy - I do not need it... I like free Internet and possibility to compare different opinions...
http://www.georgia-lies.narod.ru
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - tamuna - 08-13-2008
aranar63 Wrote:Tamuna, if they are looting Gori it just show how well the parruski army personel is pay, way to go parruskies showing your true colors now he, It is so Sad, but hey if looting make them better that anybody else (the angels army, defender of the weak)then so be it, but this is not a profesional army,but a bunch of comon criminals, but i don't blame them either hey if you get pay pennies for what you do this is the results.
professional armies are well paid, no need for looting. Oh i guess in Russian TV is being reported, that the russian army is helping residents of Gori move by taking their belongings right qwest and all of you tovarich in crime friends, you guys should applied for a US work visa and come to work as DJ, you are the masters, hey startin pay is 100k
LOOTING is now called "TAKING THEIR BELONGINGS" GREAT!!!!!!!
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - Caucasus - 08-13-2008
And think over this fact:
16 (SIXTEEN) hours the Georgian army was bombing Tskhinval. There were only civilians , about 1000 of South Ossetian Army men, and about 500 of peace-keepers. By the end of the first bombing period 1500 civilians were dead!!!! WHERE , I ask, WHERE WERE YOUR THE SO CALLED FREE MASS MEDIA?????
WHY THEY KEPT SILENCE???? WHY THEY STARTED SCREEMING ONLY WHEN RUSSIAN TROOPS ENTERED SOUTH OSSETIA???
AND ONE MORE QUESTION - WHY some articles of western mass media in internet which are more or less truly dissapear in 3-4 hour after they appear? Who tells to delete them? May be its because they do not coinside with the PREPLANNED press campaign? So I know now that there is no freedom in the west, it is a fairy-tale. The western mass media are controlled by CIA. Directly or Inderectly. I have a great respect to those journalists who try if not to tell the truth, then at least rise 'incovenient' questions to which neither Georgia, nor USA cannot give any answer.
Here in Russia (which is not free by your opinion) we can watch CNN, BBC, visit any web-site at our will. The citizens of "FREE" Georgia can not visit any site with ".ru" domain or watch Russian channels as they did several days ago. I think it is a great examle of FREEDOM of their president to lie and to take FREEDOM from his nation only by his will.
http://www.georgia-lies.narod.ru
Re: Georgia and South Ossetia at war - IamGEORGIA - 08-13-2008
What a bullshit i have read here!
The world and Europe should and must know the truth.
And the trueth is only one:
Russian Imperia, which is absoluutely in face of modern Fachism, is trying to invade Georgia, and occupy our whole teritory. In south osetia there are no ethnic osetians left, because off Russian military jets bombing the region. They have destroyed the whole city. They said there are georgian troops, but u all should know that georgian troops have withdrawn from the cregion 3 days ago, and they are now located near capital to defend Tbilisi. Russian troops and their tanks move in whole georgia and kill everyone on thei way.
Russian tropps have violated all the international rules. They are bombing hospitals, journalists, International Red Cross objects and peacufeul Citizens. They are destroying houses, killink children and woman, taking all the propertu of population, destroying cities with tanks.
They have bombed several cities which are very far from the conflict region, they have bombed there civilians..
Yesterday they take out our military ships, which are not included in military actions and they are standing in black sea, they took them out and destroyed them. They made huge eplosion on the teritory of our military bases, which are located far from conflict region.
and after all, you Europeans, people from europian civilization, do not do anything to prevent world from Agressor, who has desire to re union soviet unioon.
We georgian, will never surrender, we will fight till the end, with our president and with our people..no russian can be our boss..this will never happen..and if we are destroyed, then Ukraine and Baltic countries are next..then other europian capitals are next to be ocupied by the Red, Fashist Imperia..