Kosovo's independence...

[Aphrodite]

I don't expect the US foreign policy will change considerably. One surely can't expect projects like Camp Bondsteel (which was built on three countries' borders (Kosovo,Albania and the fYRoM) or the US embassy which is currently being built in Skopje to simply disappear.
As far as my knowledge goes, the US became such a superpower country BECAUSE they rarely (if never) change their foreign policies.

[fiflugaj]

I think Kosovo's Indipendence it is a Holy justice which is landed from God in this pained state ( Republic of Kosovo). Congratulation for whole Kosovo's citizens !!!!!! Thanks... ;-)

[M.Helen]

I think Kosovo's Indipendence it is a Holy justice which is landed from God in this pained state ( Republic of Kosovo). Congratulation for whole Kosovo's citizens !!!!!! Thanks... ;-)

the poll shows there are not many like you, fiflugaj
But, still, if it's important for you let it be so. But, if you are from Kosovo, tell me please what concrete positive changes have you noticed after gaining the independence?

[Trold]

Kosovo became independent because USA was interested in it. NATO inflamed nationalism, provided separatists with weapon, money and later by UN troops presence (also there was support of albania, Iran, etc), who acted only against serbs not albanians, so serbs was not able to do something to protect themselves and albanians easily killed thousands of Serbs.

Kosovo has always been Serbia, actually it is the hart of Serbia. Now albanians are destroing christian churches built in 15 century and killing serbs here.

The fact is that USA has always supported terrorists worldwide where USA had interests, includind Mojahedins in Afgan (who later transformed into Al-Quaeda and made 9/11). There are some sources telling that albanians in Kosovo were pretty happy when 9/11 happened because it was the "triumph of Islamic world".

The same took plase in Kroatia where 10000 serbians houses were destroyed and 300 000 serbs were forced to leave Croatia.

Let's just explain some things there, shall we?

Serbs weren't able to protect themselves? Albanians killed thousands of Serbs? Come on, please! Serbs had tanks, mig's, and a lot of bullets. What did Albanians have?? Nothing! After a while they found some old AK-47's so THEY could protect themselves. You think that Albanians should have wait for serbs to kill them? I dont think so. Killing 10.000 people (at least 95% innocent), mostly women and children. Sorry, i don't call that protection.

Oh, and yes.. about the 9/11. Please, we are trying to bring facts on the table, not sources.

I wish all the best to Albanians, also to Serbians too. :ange

[Verb]

Serbs weren't able to protect themselves? Albanians killed thousands of Serbs? Come on, please! Serbs had tanks, mig's, and a lot of bullets. What did Albanians have?? Nothing!

My dear supporter of terrorists!,

Albanians didn't need to have tanks, NATO had all the neccesary equipment. Albanians like Mojahedins was supplied with weapon by NATO and different Islamic organizations.

Albanians didn't need to have MiGs - NATO succesfully bombed Serbs (as well as albanians) during 78 days using cluster bombs and bombs with depleted uranium that caused many civilian victims from both sides - serbs and albanians, they bombed all - hospitals, shops, chinese embassy, passenger train etc. Can you imagine that they even bombed albanian columns of refugees. In such conditions Albanians were free to do whatever they want. And please face the fact that it is Serbs who left they homes, not albanians, It is 150 destroyed christian churches, not 150 mosques.

Those in Albania are the same who Dudaev, Moshadov, Boraev were in Chechnya.

[Trold]

Please don't ignore the other part of my post.

Killing 10.000 people (at least 95% innocent), mostly women and children.

Give me a reason why do you call me (or Albanians) Terrorist Supporter? But i want a very very good reason, not like those excuses you always make, blla blla blla Albanian terrorists. I want FACTS!
NATO showed up on the "game" when they had to. Serbia already had many warnings to stop what they are doing (killing, massacres etc.) in Kosovo. But your "glorious" Millosevic was following his own, and of course NATO had to bomb Serbia. Milosevic died on Hague Tribunal as a war criminal.
Of course NATO should show up, because if NATO weren't in Kosovo with the time, there would be no alive Kosovar today. And stop with those excuses like Mojahedins and stuff. Albanians are muslims only by religion, but they aren't extremists or stuff like that.

Answer me on only one question: How do you call protection, killing a 6 year old kid!? (I had the picture, but i've lost it somewhere)

As Aulona said before, Read Read History :livre

[Verb]

Killing 10.000 people (at least 95% innocent), mostly women and children.

Don't tell me your propaganda. It is Logically impossible. Even in Srebrennica there are only 1800 corpses proven. Everyone knows what did NATO's media specialists in order to demonize Serbs and to obtain excuse for bombing them, but it is not proved yet, Miloshevich was killed because they had no chance to proove his quilt.

And please remember it is Albanians who started to cut off serbians heads on serbian soil

Answer me on only one question: How do you call protection, killing a 6 year old kid!? (I had the picture, but i've lost it somewhere)

I can show yo the picture of my dead cat and tell you that it is victim of NATO bombing)))

And plese, when USA kills hundreds children in Iraq and Afgan everyday it is nothing, when serbs accidentaly kill civilians -it is evil?

The most fresh news from Afgan is that USA bombed Afgan wedding in one of the willages, many killed.

[Trold]

And please remember it is Albanians who started to cut off serbians heads on serbian soil

Answer me on only one question: How do you call protection, killing a 6 year old kid!? (I had the picture, but i've lost it somewhere)

I can show yo the picture of my dead cat and tell you that it is victim of NATO bombing)))

And plese, when USA kills hundreds children in Iraq and Afgan everyday it is nothing, when serbs accidentaly kill civilians -it is evil?

First of all, you didn't answer my question

2nd). Accidentaly??? Ok, you can take an excuse by killing 1 civilian or 2 ( or let's take 5-10 for example), and say it was an accident, but it's not an accident if you massacre them. You know what i mean?

Now YOUR cat was an accident. I'm very sorry about it

[Benn]

killing a 6 year old child is not protection, this is overprotection. Actually people who did this prove their incapacity of estimating correctly the danger. Moreover, they are cowards.

[SiD]

Give me a reason why do you call me (or Albanians) Terrorist Supporter? But i want a very very good reason, not like those excuses you always make, blla blla blla Albanian terrorists. I want FACTS!
NATO showed up on the "game" when they had to. Serbia already had many warnings to stop what they are doing (killing, massacres etc.) in Kosovo. But your "glorious" Millosevic was following his own, and of course NATO had to bomb Serbia. Milosevic died on Hague Tribunal as a war criminal.
Of course NATO should show up, because if NATO weren't in Kosovo with the time, there would be no alive Kosovar today. And stop with those excuses like Mojahedins and stuff. Albanians are muslims only by religion, but they aren't extremists or stuff like that.

Answer me on only one question: How do you call protection, killing a 6 year old kid!? (I had the picture, but i've lost it somewhere)

As Aulona said before, Read Read History :livre

Have you checked how many deaths NATO bombings of Serbia coused? You call that protection? How many Serbs were killed in Kosovo?
So you should not put up story about killed children, every war is full of such horrors.
Btw how many alive serbs are left in Kosovo now?

[Trold]

Have you checked how many deaths NATO bombings of Serbia coused? You call that protection? How many Serbs were killed in Kosovo?
So you should not put up story about killed children, every war is full of such horrors.
Btw how many alive serbs are left in Kosovo now?

What NATO did in Serbia, it's their bussiness. You ask me how many Serbs were killed in Kosovo? Well, tell me how many Albanians were killed in Kosovo????

2. How many alive serbs are left in Kosovo now?

As much as you want . The half of Mitrovica city, also Gracanica is full of Serbians. Also in Prishtina, you can hear people talking serbian in the streets very freely, and nobody touches them. It's a FACT!

[Steven]

In Mitrovica city the share of Serbs makes up about 9%, as against to the year 1961, when this share reached 22%.

[SiD]

What NATO did in Serbia, it's their bussiness. You ask me how many Serbs were killed in Kosovo? Well, tell me how many Albanians were killed in Kosovo????

2. How many alive serbs are left in Kosovo now?

As much as you want . The half of Mitrovica city, also Gracanica is full of Serbians. Also in Prishtina, you can hear people talking serbian in the streets very freely, and nobody touches them. It's a FACT!

"What NATO did in Serbia, it's their bussiness."- and what serbs did in THIER OWN COUNTRY it is not thier own business? (question following your logick).

Many serbs and albanians died during conflict and i havent denied this, just do not try to put all blame on one side only.

"As much as you want " - i want 100 millions .
But all is comperable and it is not secret for you than there are far less serbs in Kosovo than it were.

And lastly since it is topic about independance:
i consider it great mistake. Precident and quite alarming. Who is next? Kosovo just found big supporter and tadaaam - independence. Every country without enough power can face the same. And already faced actualy. South Osetia and Abkchazia are now recognized independent by Russia.

[Faw_Peter]

sid, so you're saying that in order to avoid the country's fall apart and maintain its territorial integrity a state needs better control over the regions? You see, it's all about the people's mentality, if a group of people is very stubborn and aims to separate their region from the country, they will make movements and everything possible for separating. It may last for years, and I doubt a good regional control can solve that.

[Trold]

"What NATO did in Serbia, it's their bussiness."- and what serbs did in THIER OWN COUNTRY it is not thier own business? (question following your logick).

Many serbs and albanians died during conflict and i havent denied this, just do not try to put all blame on one :| side only.

What country? Tell me, on what do you put it, that Kosovo is Serbian? Serbs emigrated on 1200's over Ballkans. If Kosovo would be serbian, then there would be no independence, that's obvious . :|


But, believe me, not that i want to blame Serbians, but it's their fault. It was serbians who started treating albanians like animals in their own place. Nobody can let you treat him like an animal at his own place.

[SiD]

sid, so you're saying that in order to avoid the country's fall apart and maintain its territorial integrity a state needs better control over the regions? You see, it's all about the people's mentality, if a group of people is very stubborn and aims to separate their region from the country, they will make movements and everything possible for separating. It may last for years, and I doubt a good regional control can solve that.

It actualy can help to solve that. There are many regions in the world that wants independence, but they are not having it. And Kosovo independence is that someone big can take advantage of internal problems bypassing UN and international law.

[SiD]

What country? Tell me, on what do you put it, that Kosovo is Serbian? Serbs emigrated on 1200's over Ballkans. If Kosovo would be serbian, then there would be no independence, that's obvious . :|


But, believe me, not that i want to blame Serbians, but it's their fault. It was serbians who started treating albanians like animals in their own place. Nobody can let you treat him like an animal at his own place.

Kosovo was and is (not by all countrys) recognized as part of Serbia. Or you think USA must get out and give thier lands to native americans? Remind me wenn first colonists showed up? SO it was and IS (as i said) part of thier country.

And what exactly you put into: treat like animals?
Besides USA, EU, NATO and all are not boyscouts of earth comming to help to vanether is in need. They follow thier interests. And serbians just have misfortune to not have means to trown them out. And like what they done was not enough they made precident that can lead to even more conflicts. Simplest question: WHY? Kosovo could be granted autonomy and that could ease the matter.

[Trold]

Kosovo is recognized from more than 50 countries as an independent country. Not to mention the other countries that are about to recognize it.


Kosovo could be granted autonomy??????

Millosevic came in Kosovo on 1995 (or 1985, i dont remember exactly) and said: Kosovo has no autonomy in this country. No one can touch serbians here.



If you make it so simple like that, then why did all these stuff happened? The war, all those conflicts and the hate for each other.

[M.Helen]

50 states is not enough for being independent. The countries that are about to recognize it are simply doing it due to solidarity. That is because if you don't recognize Kosovo's independence, you are the EU's enemy.

[Aphrodite]

50 states is not enough for being independent. The countries that are about to recognize it are simply doing it due to solidarity. That is because if you don't recognize Kosovo's independence, you are the EU's enemy.

Have we adopted the good old "either you're with us or against us" policy then?

[independent]

Have we adopted the good old "either you're with us or against us" policy then?

We developed that attitude ourself - so we don't need to adopt it - it is pure realism (and have always been so).
Kosovo is just now a separator between many countries - and even I support the idea of them having
independence / autonomy - I'm still disappointed about how it was achieved.

[SiD]

Kosovo is recognized from more than 50 countries as an independent country. Not to mention the other countries that are about to recognize it.


Kosovo could be granted autonomy??????

Millosevic came in Kosovo on 1995 (or 1985, i dont remember exactly) and said: Kosovo has no autonomy in this country. No one can touch serbians here.



If you make it so simple like that, then why did all these stuff happened? The war, all those conflicts and the hate for each other.

Even recognition of 1 country like USA is enough to make independence, but it doesnt changes fact that Kosovo isnt recognized by ALL countrys.

I asked you to explain how is it to "treat like animal". I hope that you doesnt mean that wenn albanians were refused to "touch" serbs was it.

Autonomy was most optimal solution. It could be agreed by all, but albanians DEMANDED independence knowing that US will support them. And wenn it was clear that it cant be achieved trough negotiations US just proclaimed it, by recognizing Kosovo, and many nations supported it. Screw national integrity, UN, international law, might makes right. Did it brought any security and stability to the world? NO. Now US seems not to like thier own medicine wenn it is used against countrys they support.

And what am i making simple? a just havent understood your question. Granting autonomy is so simple solution you think? It is not.

[Aphrodite]

Have we adopted the good old "either you're with us or against us" policy then?

We developed that attitude ourself - so we don't need to adopt it - it is pure realism (and have always been so).
Kosovo is just now a separator between many countries - and even I support the idea of them having
independence / autonomy - I'm still disappointed about how it was achieved.

I wouldn't call it realism.Sounds more like fascism from where I stand..What happened to the opt out choice?

I'm all for countries becoming independent.I have to admit though I'm a tad suspicious about this one.I fear a new area of attrocities will erupt in the Balkans, regardless of whether Kosovo gains its independence or not.

[independent]

I wouldn't call it realism.Sounds more like fascism from where I stand..What happened to the opt out choice?

I'm all for countries becoming independent.I have to admit though I'm a tad suspicious about this one.I fear a new area of attrocities will erupt in the Balkans, regardless of whether Kosovo gains its independence or not.

You need to have power to get some real choices - without it You depend of how well Your will
suits to interest of powerful countries. Why You think it is bad if e.g. Balkans don't keep their
present borders ? Because we have interest of our owns there ?

[Hellenicoz]

I cant believe it how FYROM voted for Kosovo's independence and back stabbed Serbia. To think Serbia were one of the first countries to recognise FYROM as the Republic of Macedonia and not the official UN name of the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia.