Abkhazia in the Georgian-Russian war 2008

[aley]

no its definetly not. I tried 2 find facts of the process when your dear lovely churchill was tried to set a contact with Hitler to set a common front against soviets but this fact is just not in it so it lost its credibility to me. sorry.

[GAMS]

OSETIN GENOCIDE
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GAMS, several days ago I have provide the citation from Lakoba's (He is historian) Book with source and page, where he talks that mankind in deep history talked in Abkhazian language and in future the whole mankind will talk in Abkhazian language. He found very close relation with Tibetian, chinase, african languages and decided that all these languages originated from abkhazian. Do you agree? Such people are making new abkhazian history, so do not be eager enough just to trust their (Abkhazian Historians) sources

No, not agree.

[lashachochua]

Once more I have to finilize these talks about modern Abkhazians.

Fact 1. Famous Russian roadster Atanase Nikitini in XV century was writting that Sokhumi, more precisely Sokhumi cape was Georgian Land Source: L. S. Baranov,- "Afanasii Nikitin - pervii ruskii puteshestvenik v indiu" Kalinin, 1939, page 74

Fact 2. Diachkov-Tarasov was writing: "The modern abkhazians did not live there all time where they are living now. They came from North and oppressed Georgian tribes" Source: F. Fadiev: " kratkii ocherk istorii abxazii" I, Soxumi, 1934, page 51

Fact 3 From archaeologist Sizov report: "The seedbed of culture discovered by me in the teritory of Abkhazia mostly wears the sign of Georgian Culture" source: A. S. Xaxanov: "drevneishii predeli zaselenia gruzii po maloi azii" tiflis, 1906, page 62-63

these are not georgian sources, two of them are russians and one is Abkhazian... I am not providing many sources by Arab, Turkish, Bizantian, Greek authors....

Now I will provide one citation from abkhazian historian Gulia: "Kolkhs are the same Abkhazians, they originated from Africa...(advancing this idea there is natuaral question whether was or not first Abkhazian black) Gulia on this question replies: Probably not" source: D. I. Gulia "Sukhum ne Dioskuria" trudi abxazsko nauchno-isledavatelskovo instituta kravedenie, vipusk btaroi, cuxum, 1934, page. 87

Now you have to decide which sources to trust....If this will not be enough I can provide far more historical arguments with sources.........

[GAMS]

We want to live freely!

[lashachochua]

We want to live freely!

who oppressed your liberty??????? We have to live freely in reality and justice!

[GAMS]

Georgia wants to put to death my people

[lashachochua]

Georgia wants to put to death my people

No GAMS, Georgia does not want that... I am Georgian and I do not want that.....Are you Abkhazian?
If yes it will be great, I really want to have as many abkhazian friends as possible....Trust me man. These words comes from my heart (the same I can say about Ossetians)

[Eka]

GAMS

Wonderful pictures.
Thanks,
But what is freedom for you? 1. Freedom with Russia as authonomia like chechnia.
2. Freedom from everyone. Just be free.. (It’s very difficult, because you will not fulfill 1.)
3. Freedom with Georgia in vide autonomy as Catalonia has in Spain... (And in few years we guarantee you prosperity and recognition all over the world) Remember EU can give very strong guarantees to ethnicities. Russian cannot do it (remember Chechnya, Ingushetia and soon Dagestan will join the club).

I don’t know when but EU will open doors for us and then these doors will be open for you too. Think about these 3 options. Russia supposes you to be there province, to produce cement there and there generals to hAVE houses there and you will serve them. Oligarxes will not came to AbxazeTi- they have villas in Cot dazure.They dont need unstable situation. Rusian Genarals will come with plesure, but will not bring investments.

And now look at Ajara. In few years they become richer many times. And turists from many countires are there in huge amanout. The 1 calss hotels are bilding, investments in property in very big there. Case of georigans who lived in Abxazeti and now are IDP will be Domokl Sword on your head.So analize, who wants us to be enemeys? I have answer - corupted Bagapshs govermant and our govrmant in 90-th not you abxaz people and not we georgian people. So its better to be together then to for you to be part of Russia. Think everyone is afraid of them and dislike them. Way? Everyone Is stupid and you clever? No of course.

And if you want to be indeendant OK. Lets have referendum with all IDPs from Abxazeti. And if YOU - ALL TOGETHER want independence from Georgia, YOU will receive it.

[lashachochua]

GAMS

Wonderful pictures.
Thanks,
But what is freedom for you? 1. Freedom with Russia as authonomia like chechnia.
2. Freedom from everyone. Just be free.. (It’s very difficult, because you will not fulfill 1.)
3. Freedom with Georgia in vide autonomy as Catalonia has in Spain... (And in few years we guarantee you prosperity and recognition all over the world) Remember EU can give very strong guarantees to ethnicities. Russian cannot do it (remember Chechnya, Ingushetia and soon Dagestan will join the club).

I don’t know when but EU will open doors for us and then these doors will be open for you too. Think about these 3 options. Russia supposes you to be there province, to produce cement there and there generals to hAVE houses there and you will serve them. Oligarxes will not came to AbxazeTi- they have villas in Cot dazure.They dont need unstable situation. Rusian Genarals will come with plesure, but will not bring investments.

And now look at Ajara. In few years they become richer many times. And turists from many countires are there in huge amanout. The 1 calss hotels are bilding, investments in property in very big there. Case of georigans who lived in Abxazeti and now are IDP will be Domokl Sword on your head.So analize, who wants us to be enemeys? I have answer - corupted Bagapshs govermant and our govrmant in 90-th not you abxaz people and not we georgian people. So its better to be together then to for you to be part of Russia. Think everyone is afraid of them and dislike them. Way? Everyone Is stupid and you clever? No of course.

And if you want to be indeendant OK. Lets have referendum with all IDPs from Abxazeti. And if YOU - ALL TOGETHER want independence from Georgia, YOU will receive it.

Eka, sorry, but I disagree with you...It is not about economic calculations... First what we geargians have to do is to make our Abkhazian people not to think that we want their death. We do not want that.....

[Eka]

GAMS

Wonderful pictures.
Thanks,
But what is freedom for you? 1. Freedom with Russia as authonomia like chechnia.
2. Freedom from everyone. Just be free.. (It’s very difficult, because you will not fulfill 1.)
3. Freedom with Georgia in vide autonomy as Catalonia has in Spain... (And in few years we guarantee you prosperity and recognition all over the world) Remember EU can give very strong guarantees to ethnicities. Russian cannot do it (remember Chechnya, Ingushetia and soon Dagestan will join the club).

I don’t know when but EU will open doors for us and then these doors will be open for you too. Think about these 3 options. Russia supposes you to be there province, to produce cement there and there generals to hAVE houses there and you will serve them. Oligarxes will not came to AbxazeTi- they have villas in Cot dazure.They dont need unstable situation. Rusian Genarals will come with plesure, but will not bring investments.

And now look at Ajara. In few years they become richer many times. And turists from many countires are there in huge amanout. The 1 calss hotels are bilding, investments in property in very big there. Case of georigans who lived in Abxazeti and now are IDP will be Domokl Sword on your head.So analize, who wants us to be enemeys? I have answer - corupted Bagapshs govermant and our govrmant in 90-th not you abxaz people and not we georgian people. So its better to be together then to for you to be part of Russia. Think everyone is afraid of them and dislike them. Way? Everyone Is stupid and you clever? No of course.

And if you want to be indeendant OK. Lets have referendum with all IDPs from Abxazeti. And if YOU - ALL TOGETHER want independence from Georgia, YOU will receive it.

Eka, sorry, but I disagree with you...It is not about economic calculations... First what we geargians have to do is to make our Abkhazian people not to think that we want their death. We do not want that.....

Lasha I agree with you. You are right 100%. Its even can not be discused we dont want there death. We want only peacefull prosperious life for them within EU.And for us the same.

[GAMS]

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We do not want such
2100 peaceful people perished
Then there was Abhazia

[Eka]

http://www.eu-forums.com/viewtopic.php?f...a&start=30
We do not want such
2100 peaceful people perished
Then there was Abhazia

GAMS vizit <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.grani.ru">http://www.grani.ru</a><!-- w --> and human right watch sites and you will know how many vicitims were on this war from both sides. I am very sorry for every civilian and soldger for both sides, but god sees that it was not my country who stared this war. Vizit HRW site and listen on grani ru to ANNA Neistat: <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://grani-tv.ru/">http://grani-tv.ru/</a><!-- m -->. And analize for yor self.Dont be blinded by russian propaganda - you want to be free so be it.Learn to be free..

[lashachochua]

http://www.eu-forums.com/viewtopic.php?f...a&start=30
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We do not want such
2100 peaceful people perished
Then there was Abhazia

GAMS just you have also t understand our position. Many georgians lived on this territory for ages...We do not want to loose our teritory. We do not want to lose our history. But we want to live with you in peace.

[Eka]

And GAMS belive me we can be happy together again. Not in USSR, but in Georgia with videst authonomy yoou can emegine.You will feel reall safety only with EU and Georgia.

[GAMS]

We want to be free without Georgia!!!!

[lashachochua]

We want to be free without Georgia!!!!

GAMS, I have sent you a private sms. Plz see and would appriciate if you reply

[GAMS]

We were acknowledged by Russia.Soon we are acknowledged by 20 countries.A reverse road is not present!

[Eka]

I have done it too. So waiting for replay.

[lashachochua]

We were acknowledged by Russia.Soon we are acknowledged by 20 countries.A reverse road is not present!

GAMS, are you sure? Do not you see that Russia is alone in this job and forcing now her setallite countries to follow her step....Do you think that this is optimal solution of the problem.

Just I have one question, if your government will decide to join Russia, what will be your personal position?

[Eka]

We were acknowledged by Russia.Soon we are acknowledged by 20 countries.A reverse road is not present!

Who will be this countries. As you have access to internet you can check that Russia is forcing the Armenia and Beloruus to do it and many other to. But it will be not same. Look around . You are in worse condition you were before this " recognition"
Медведев: Страны ОДКБ должны определиться по Грузии

Страны-члены ОДКБ должны сформулировать свою позицию по событиям на Кавказе на саммите в Москве, который состоится в конце недели. Как передает Интерфакс, об этом заявил президент России Дмитрий Медведев на встрече в Сочи с президентом Армении Сержем Саркисяном.

"К Армении на следующем заседании ОДКБ переходит председательство. Мы с вами не виделись после грузинской агрессии. Я хотел бы поделиться соображениями в связи с этим", - сказал Медведев, открывая встречу с Саркисяном. "Мы с вами обсудим предварительно работу в формате ОДКБ, окончательную позицию сформулируем во время саммита ОДКБ в Москве", - сказал Медведев. "Согласен", - ответил Саркисян.

Медведев также поблагодарил Саркисяна за "гуманитарные формы поддержки" Южной Осетии со стороны Армении. Президент Армении со своей стороны заявил, что сожалеет о трагических событиях в Южной Осетии, и выразил соболезнования в связи с гибелью российских граждан и миротворцев.

Страны ОДКБ не выработали единого мнения по отношению к российско-грузинскому конфликту на состоявшемся 21 августа заседании Совета министров ОДКБ. В ОДКБ входят Армения, Белоруссия, Казахстан, Киргизия, Узбекистан, Россия и Таджикистан.

28 августа посол Белоруссии в России Василий Долголев сообщил, что Белоруссия в ближайшее время заявит о поддержке независимости Абхазии и Южной Осетии. В тот же день президент Белоруссии Александр Лукашенко направил послание Дмитрию Медведеву, в котором высказался за консолидированную позицию ОДКБ по Южной Осетии и Абхазии, а также заверил в союзническом отношении к России.
02.09.2008 14:34 <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.grani.ru/Politics/World/Europe/Georgia/p.140868.html">http://www.grani.ru/Politics/World/Euro ... 40868.html</a><!-- m -->

[EU1]

I have read what was writtenabout this topic. Dear Georgians, it is great that you think friendly about abkhazia but that's not you who make decisions. For example, if your president wants to clean Abkhazia from Abkhazs you will not be able to stop it, maybe there will be meetings with a few persons and that's all. Besides georgians mostly support solutions of their president. I have not read a message asking to forgive for the situation that was in S Ossetia. Instead of it you try to convince that your soldier came there with flowers and there were not casualties among civilians. Were you against when your soldier killed civilians bombing towns at night? NO. You don't think about people living in Abkhazia and S Ossetia, you need only these lands and don't care about local people leaving there otherwise we would see another methods in S Ossetia and it is likely in Abkazia if Ossetia would have been conquered. Your actions show better what you want then your words.

[EU1]

History of henocide of Ossetians

Part 1
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Part 2
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWm7OnwyNFI&NR=1">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWm7OnwyNFI&NR=1</a><!-- m -->

[EU1]

Media battle which is also taking place at this forum too, it is in English:

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEf6XfWe6MY&NR=1">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEf6XfWe6MY&NR=1</a><!-- m -->

[Eka]

Media battle which is also taking place at this forum too, it is in English:

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEf6XfWe6MY&NR=1">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEf6XfWe6MY&NR=1</a><!-- m -->

Hi Eu1 . So what are you doing now? Frigtening Abxazians? They are frigthtened to much with idea to be swallowed by Russia and there "independace" is fiction and as I understand they are very tensed about this.

You are rupor of your govermant propaganda at this moment. There are different weivs about this war. So please let people to know the both sides.

Now about can we take deccisions or no - I can asure you that we can have influance on our govermant and this influance is called ELECTIONS.You heard something about it? its When prople can go and express their opinion about current goverman. So we will do it when we wil have elections. We expressed it when we dispalced Shevardnadze ( he was inspirator of conflict with Abxazia in beginin of 90th).

If its need we can dispalce this govermant but by free elections .But Russia govermant can not order us to do this or another steps which will bring country to chaos.

So if Abxazians wil have terorists who will begin to terorize Gali region Georgian villages, if they will kill people by shooting and bombing the answer of govermant be such - it MUST protect it citizens there( As Russian have done in Sida kartli yes? ). Or Russians can protect there citizens and we can not do so?
But I am 100% sure that abxazian people is not gilty in 90-th events its there govermant. so when they will realize it everything will be OK.
About clining teritories from ethnicities living there - its Russians maner of behavior ( Chechnia and whole Caucasia during 19 to 21 centyre) remember Shamil? Do you know who is he?. We are not " clinig " teritories. Its your govermant rules and even expression like" zachistka" - we have not such words in Georgian at all. So you have copiright on such behavior ( begining rom Afganistan ).Sorry copiright for similar actions belongs to mr. Hitler and that Mr. Putin only reapeated the same.

[the globe]

Present situation in Russian bears a strong resemblance to that in Germany of 30-th years:, aggressive behavior against neighboring states, nationalistic demagogy, fuehrer, aspiration for world supremacy, short-term economic take-off, blitzkrieg and anschluss territory of a neighboring state upon the pretext of protection of alien residents, nation-wide giddiness due to early military successes, a connivance of some European countries, and eventually, a large-scale military adventure…..